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Re: Repealing the Social Security Windfall Elimination Provision And Pension Offset 2017 Legislation

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Message 41 of 110

Social security is “free” if you are the stay at home spouse of a contributor.  So working people get penalized but many stay at home spouses, who are not low income wage earners get a free ride?  This of course is more related to WEP’s evil twin, GPO.  There is no rationale for taking away survivorship benefits.  Gail, I’m glad your friend was so informed and able to plan for a well earned retirement.  Many of us got no information which would have prompted further research and planning—or if they did, it was in the mice type that legally covered employers. 

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Re: Repealing the Social Security Windfall Elimination Provision And Pension Offset 2017 Legislation

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Message 42 of 110

GAIL 1 offered a very thorough explanation of the theory behind WEP legislation.  I now have a clear picture of why it came about.  I guess in my situation I am within less than three years of having sufficient employment under Social Security coverage to escape WEP entirely.  Because of my particular situation the impact of WEP is minimum, however even if the current formula works to my advantage, personally I feel that it was my decision to be a part of the workforce long enough should not subject me or others in the same category to ANY penality.  It is what it is and if no changes come about I should just learn to appreciate the position I am in.

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Re: Repealing the Social Security Windfall Elimination Provision And Pension Offset 2017 Legislation

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Message 43 of 110

@SteveT934531 wrote:

  I am amazed with every day that passes, and that more and more people who have worked are getting SCREWED by the law passed in 1983, . . . . .  What is it going to take to get some action to relieve us from this financial burden?  

 

If all the cries about how unfair determinations are made regarding the manner in which Social Security COLA's are figured GO NOWHERE, how can we as a relatively small segment of this country's population ever expect any help regarding GPO/WEP.  

 

I live in Florida a state with many retired federal workers and in spite of that those members of Congress are not the least bit interested in co-sponsoring or otherwise endorsing legislation which would support help for us.    Without a doubt, the current workforce in this country had better be putting away significant amounts of money, or making wise investments because if they are to depend upon any help from the federal government they will end up on the welfare rolls as a receiver of assistance.  This country gives  "free" aid to countries all over the world, and yet refuses to care for the workforce which helped to build the economic system which built this Nation.  

 

Where did the principle of hard work and contributing to one's "golden years" go wrong? 


You didn't get screwed by the invention of the WEP - you got a more accurate formula that the previous one based on the amount of time you worked under a Social Security contributing entity.  You did NOT pay into the Social Security system while ONLY working for the Government affiliated entity.

 

People in this situation perhaps need a manually figured formula because you are outliers.  You are not low income earners like the OLD formula used.  You may have worked under the SS system for 10 - 30 years and the WEP adjust for these years of SS participation and contributions.  Those that only worked a few years under the SS system get the most reduction and those who worked longer under the SS system get less of a deduction.  When a person worked under the SS system for 30 - 35 years, they have little to NO WEP reduction.  I have a friend who 1st worked under the SS system via an employer. then he went to work for a government entity with a pension program.  He recoginized the problem and so he began a sole-proprietor business and worked there in his off time from the government job and paid in both parts of contributions (employer/employee).  He fulfilled over 35 years under the SS system and got his pension too.  He has NO WEP deduction.

 

The SS system is a DIRECT contributory system; it isn't free - don't contribute, don't get vested  and you get nil. While you as a government worker were off working for a government entity that didn't participate in the SS system, you were still contributing to and earning a pension while those under the SS sytem were contributing to and earning their benefit.  Both were working hard but developing their golden years retirement in a different way.  Or as my friend, doing both and receiving both.

 

You are still getting the SS benefit if you worked long enough to be vested in the SS system.

In fact, the WEP may not be off that much if at all based on the number of years which you worked under the SS system. 

 

Come up with a fairer (?) formula, maybe a manually figured one, and send it to your Congressman for consideration.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

* * * * It's Always Something . . . Roseanne Roseannadanna
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Re: Repealing the Social Security Windfall Elimination Provision And Pension Offset 2017 Legislation

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Message 44 of 110

Here we are almost all the way through January 2019.  The Congressmen are "busy" re introducing legislation to pacify their constitutents knowing full well that because this bill will cost MONEY, and only reflects those of us who are retired will ultimately GO NOWHERE.  I am amazed with every day that passes, and that more and more people who have worked are getting SCREWED by the law passed in 1983, and yet those people WE send to Congress blow us off.  What is it going to take to get some action to relieve us from this financial burden?  

 

If all the cries about how unfair determinations are made regarding the manner in which Social Security COLA's are figured GO NOWHERE, how can we as a relatively small segment of this country's population ever expect any help regarding GPO/WEP.  

 

I live in Florida a state with many retired federal workers and in spite of that those members of Congress are not the least bit interested in co-sponsoring or otherwise endorsing legislation which would support help for us.    Without a doubt, the current workforce in this country had better be putting away significant amounts of money, or making wise investments because if they are to depend upon any help from the federal government they will end up on the welfare rolls as a receiver of assistance.  This country gives  "free" aid to countries all over the world, and yet refuses to care for the workforce which helped to build the economic system which built this Nation.  

 

Where did the principle of hard work and contributing to one's "golden years" go wrong? 

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Re: Repealing the Social Security Windfall Elimination Provision And Pension Offset 2017 Legislation

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Message 45 of 110

@nm5358 wrote:

Most people, in this day and age are lucky if the can work 35 years in their careers, thanks to constant recessions, lay offs, staff reductions, off shoring and out sourcing. The WEP does not kick in, if you worked 30 years. paid into Social Security, and worked a job that provides a public pension.

 

Your "KISS" method will penalize all workers and, most liekly, reduce their benefits, than what the current fromula Social Security uses.

 

So, if one has given up their public pension, they should not be hit by the WEP. And, any income earned, while under a public pension, should count as earned income for Social Seurity benefit calculations, in regards to "substantial income".


If you have a job that requires you to pay into their pension plan, you cannot forgo it. Giving up your Public Pension will not keep you from getting WEP'ed. As far as Social Security is concerned you did not pay into the system. What Social Security needs to do is pay you according to the number of quarters you earned.  Equal treatment across the board. 

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Re: Repealing the Social Security Windfall Elimination Provision And Pension Offset 2017 Legislation

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Message 46 of 110

Most people, in this day and age are lucky if the can work 35 years in their careers, thanks to constant recessions, lay offs, staff reductions, off shoring and out sourcing. The WEP does not kick in, if you worked 30 years. paid into Social Security, and worked a job that provides a public pension.

 

Your "KISS" method will penalize all workers and, most liekly, reduce their benefits, than what the current fromula Social Security uses.

 

So, if one has given up their public pension, they should not be hit by the WEP. And, any income earned, while under a public pension, should count as earned income for Social Seurity benefit calculations, in regards to "substantial income".

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Re: Repealing the Social Security Windfall Elimination Provision And Pension Offset 2017 Legislation

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Message 47 of 110
Why make thing simple when you can make them complicated... SS pension should be calculated based on the average of the last 35 years of work. If of 35 years, one has only contributed 20 years, one will see a lower average and a lower pension period. Let's apply KISS here and get rid of any SNAFU in this system.
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Re: Repealing the Social Security Windfall Elimination Provision And Pension Offset 2017 Legislation

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Message 48 of 110

I certainly agree. When you get your 1099 each year, it should indicate what you received in Social Secuity benefits, and what the total WEP penalty was; if any.. There should be a place, on the 1040 to take a credit, on taxes owed on Social Secuirty benefits and retirement income from an IRA. Though, the best solution is to eliminate teh WEP entirely. And, when they do, the legislation shoudl retore all penalized benefits, in full.

 

Of course, Congress, does not want to pay back what they "borrowed" from teh Social Security trust fund; let alone people penalized by the WEP.. This is part of the national debt they could easily write off, if they coudl get away with it. Both parties have had a hand in why Social Security and Medicare have solvency problems. They do not want to raise taxes on their wealthy minders.

 

There are Republicans, as well as soem Democrats, who would want to reform so called "entitlements" to take money and health care out of the pockets of retirees. Right now, for example, the spending bill will increase the Medicare Part D donut hole and foce people to pay more for medications. Another example, AARP, at one time, supported chained CPI to determien COLA for Social Security, unti its members, and non-members, pushed back; hard.

 

Congress, and the SSA, want to keep the WEP penalty hidden. In that way, it makes it near impossible for thsoe affected to know how they are being, for no better term, "robbed" of benefits. Also, they are hoping that those, penalized by the WEP, would not notice they were actually were. And, of course, they are hoping people just die, before they notice.

 

The chances, of WEP going away, with Trump in the White House, and the Senate in GOP hands, is about zero. And, the Democrats will be too busy impeaching Trump to do anything else, Expect two more years of gridlock and this being addressed after 2020; if ever.

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Re: Repealing the Social Security Windfall Elimination Provision And Pension Offset 2017 Legislation

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Message 49 of 110

@mommak101 wrote:

Thanks!  I do have that information.  I believe the deduction should be reflected on the SocSec payment summary and not hidden.  This is an actual deduction from the earned benefit and should be shown as such.


If you know the amount of your pension and the years that you worked under the SS system and the amount of your earnings in those years (SS statements or your own records), you should be able to figure it using this formula from the SSA.  The WEP reduction maximum ( WEP guarantee) in the example is for 2012.

 

The WEP reduction maximum (WEP guarantee) in 2018 is $ 447.50.

 

SSA Program Explainer: Windfall Elimination Provision

 

But do keep in mind that any other deduction or additions are also considered in the formula like early retirement (deduction), COLA or delayed retirement (additions).

* * * * It's Always Something . . . Roseanne Roseannadanna
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Re: Repealing the Social Security Windfall Elimination Provision And Pension Offset 2017 Legislation

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Message 50 of 110

Thanks!  I do have that information.  I believe the deduction should be reflected on the SocSec payment summary and not hidden.  This is an actual deduction from the earned benefit and should be shown as such.

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