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Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

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Message 761 of 1,033

Since 1 in 5 American teens have moderate to severe dental fluorosis on at least two brittle teeth and dental fluorosis is the visible evidence of cell death due to fluoride exposure, senior citizens should be paying attention because their bones are also more brittle due to a lifetime of fluoride exposure.

 

I know, it happened to me and I’m a chemist formerly with the Army Corps of Engineers recognized whistleblower to lead in drinking water. I have moderate to severe dental fluorosis from childhood as the daughter of a military dentist. This has been a lifelong embarrassment. I had veneers finally at 40. Now at 65, I have many health concerns including problems with thyroid, parathyroid, kidney stones and joint failure. (Hip bone ashed measured 1500 ppm F) with slow improvements avoiding F now for 5 years. There is no miracle cure for F accumulation and only the subtle progressively increasingly serious damage as a risk. The lack of medical recognition of the disease processes from chronic F poisoning makes it difficult to get help.

 

To medical professionals who say no damage even from a lifetime of F exposure: where you don’t honestly look, you will not find. Cite all the skewed studies you want, your willful blindness boaders on negligence. Everyone should diligently ask how could consuming a known accumulative poison possible be good for you or even your pets?

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Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

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Message 762 of 1,033

“It is very unwise to assume that little or none of the extensive middle and old-age osteoarthritis that plagues so many people in the United States is not an undiagnosed manifestation of various stages of skeletal fluorosis.” - Dr. Albert W. Burgstahler, chemist in letter to NAS/IOM (1998)

 

Dental fluorosis (DF) is the visible evidence of a defect in the tooth. It is evidence of cell death in every case and due to fluoride consumption. Always. Period. These teeth are more brittle. It is caused by fluoride consumption in early childhood but is a lifelong condition that increases dental bills. As fluoridation has increased in the US, so has DF so that it now afflicts over half of US teens.  

 

Skeletal fluorosis (SF) is the invisible evidence of the same process which manifests as pain in the bones and increased brittleness. This is a cumulative process that in 'optimally' fluoridated communities afflicts adults in middle age and senior citizens. Because fluoridation is supported by US agencies and administered by US governmental authoritis, skeletal fluorosis is misdiagnosed as any number of other conditions. All foods prepared with fluoridated water are contaminated with fluoride - often at much higher concentrations than in tap water.

 

DFwQuotes.jpg

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Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

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Message 763 of 1,033

Millions  of people are being harmed from fluoridated water. Consumers all  accumulate F in bone,, causing formation of poor quality bone to varying degree.

Three court cases ruled that fluoridated water consumption can cause cancer in people. Who am I to overturn these rulings?

The study claiming reduced decay in fluorotic molars is not a valid conclusion I would make based on the data. The confidence intervals overlap substantially between fluoridated and nonfluoridated. Moreover as I have said the studies like this on people who cannot be put in cages are not well controlled, as for animals in cages  

 The animal data are conclusive and agree with the largest human data we have on populations showing fluoride water is useless in decreasing dental decay.

Sorry. 

 

Richard Sauerheber, Ph.D.
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Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

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Message 764 of 1,033

As  said, the FDA does not permit itself to label fluoride levels in water, or to require that fluoride be labeled on bottled water by anyone. If you have a problem with that or with companies that label the fluoride level in their bottled water, then take it up with the FDA

 Dr. Groth first instituted this FDA policy, not me. If it were me, I would require fluoride level labeling if the water is  either natural at 1 ppm or above  or if any fluoride was added artificially from an industrial source. But that is me. 

Richard Sauerheber, Ph.D.
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Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

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Message 765 of 1,033

Dr. Sauerheber,

 

I take it from your responses that you are not able to cite one documented case of any human being who was harmed in any way because they drank optimally fluoridated water . . even for as much as a lifetime . . .

 

. . . that you are unable to explain your contradictory statements that on one hand the FDA “forbids” bottled water distributors from providing fluoride levels in water . . yet on the other hand they don’t ban it . .

 

. . . and that you are still unwilling to admit that mild dental fluorosis, which is associated with community water fluoridation, makes teeth stronger and more resistant to decay, thus improving quality of life.

 

CONCLUSION:

This study's findings suggest that molars with fluorosis are more resistant to caries than are molars without fluorosis.”  www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19571049

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Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

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Message 766 of 1,033

Fluorosis ends with the suffix osis because it is pathologic. It is only caused by fluoride Ingestion during childhood. Fluoridated water is one of, and usually the most significant, source of ingested fluoride that causes fluorosis. The systemic fluoride contaminant inhibits protein removal during teeth mineralization. It does so as an enzyme inhibitor. 

Notice however  that proving water fluoride, rather than some other fluoride source, is the cause would be disputed in court and, just as with mild bone fluorosis,  this interferes with lawsuits. 

I also  do this because evil flourishes when good people ignore the problem. U. S. kids are being fluoride poisoned, with fluorosis being the first visible sign. In adulthood the fluoride accumulation continues into bone, causing formation of permanent bone of poor quality, to varying degtees depending on total exposure. 

 

 

Richard Sauerheber, Ph.D.
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Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

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Message 767 of 1,033

Mild fluorosis due to fluoride Ingestion and moderate or severe fluorosis are abnormalities, with deficient enamel on teeth

Flluorosis of varying degree increases in incidence in all Fluoridated cities. There are no exceptions

Richard Sauerheber, Ph.D.
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Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

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Message 768 of 1,033

 

Dr. Sauerheber, your quotes, copy/pasted from your comments: 

 

“07-13-2018 03:58 PM

There are no lies in any of my posts. The FDA statements and actions are what they are.”

 

Of course there are.  Here is one of many examples in this thread alone.

 

“07-12-2018 03:46 PM

Furthermore, fluoride levels in water are forbiddenfrom  being listed on bottled water because that would give the false impression to the public that fluoride actually belongs in water. “  End quote.

 

After I provided a link to a label of bottled water on which fluoride was listed at 0.77 ppm, you changed your story to this:

 

“07-13-2018 11:16 AM

The FDA does not require labeling fluoride on bottled water--but the FDA also does not ban it.“  End quote.

 

“The FDA statements and actions are what they are.”

 

Those aren’t FDA statements.  Those are YOUR statements alleging contradictory policy.  YOUR statements are false.

 

Please be kind enough to show me that somehow both of these contradictory statements, by you, are correct.  Please provide a links to FDA websites proving your statements are not lies.

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Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

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Message 769 of 1,033

Dr. Sauerheber you say, “People on this site who preach fluoridation . . “

 

First of all, to be clear, I don’t “preach fluoridation.”  I preach against unwarranted scare mongering.

 

Second, in your comment below you simply use the phrase “dental fluorosis,” or, “dental enamel fluorosis” as if all degrees of fluorosis are the same.  You know that is not true, and this blurring of the different degrees of fluorosis is typical of scare-mongers.   

 

You know that the mild degrees of fluorosis improve the health of teeth, making them more resistant to decay, improving quality of life, while the more severe degrees of fluorosis, which are NOT associated with optimally fluoridated water, are detrimental to quality of life . . just as dental decay is detrimental to quality of life.  That in itself is a lie by deception.

 

I mean, isn’t it odd that someone who claims to be a knowledgeable scientist is so vague when describing degrees of the symptoms of fluoride ingestion. 

 

Third, and to the point of your comment below, you claim that a lawsuit for health reasons would be almost impossible to prove in court.  That is interesting.  All you would need to have a successful lawsuit for health reasons is one documented case of any human being who has ever been harmed because they drank optimally fluoridated water . . even for as much as a lifetime. 

 

Are you saying there has never been one documented case of harm to any human being from drinking optimally fluoridated water?  If there was . . you could win your lawsuit.

 

Speaking of lies, Sirpac says, “David, who is a troll, engages Dr. Sauerhaber into neverending distraction and falsification, because that is his job, . . “

 

Sirpac, no one is paying me to thwart the efforts of a few paranoia-generating scare mongers as they attempt to hijack a proven health initiative.  I do it because evil thrives when good people are silent.  But I appreciate you proving my point that most of you scare mongers don’t tell the truth.  Thank you.

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Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

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Message 770 of 1,033

There are no lies in any of my posts. The FDA statements and actions are what they are.

 

As far as lawsuits for health effects of drinking fluoridated water, one that might have a chance of being proven would be hip replacement surgeries where the denigrated bone is assayed for fluoride. But physicisn don't order such tess. Period. Some patients have paid for them themselves at indsutrial analytical laboratories (non-clinical). But again, the suit would likely fail because people actually believe that fluoride belongs in bone and blood, when it doesn't.

 

Cigarette smoking many people tolerate genetically well, and bone fluoride can be tolerated by some to fairly high levels without necessarily developing pain, that others cannot tolerate. It took over 60 years of intense fighting to finally get cigarette makers to agree that smoking causes cancer in susceptible people even though others can tolerate it. And it would take just as long to convince fluoridationists that fluoridation of bone causes bone weakening and structural abnormality and in many cases bone pain. Lawsuits are not likely to go anywhere because fluoridationists would argue the exopsrue came from somewhere else, not the water. This is alreeady being done now with dental fluorosis. Water districts berate that dental enamel fluorosis is the fault of toothpaste makers since water fluoridation started first and toothpaste added to the total fluoride dose. But toothpaste makers blame water districts since toothpaste (by FDA guidelines) is "not to be swallowed or used in children undeer 6", while water fluoride is added with the specific intent to be swallowed. It is swallowed fluoride from both sources that casue dental fluorosis. So how does the lawsuit proceed on the premise that fluoride causes harm? Jeff Green avoided such impossible lawsuits under these ciricumstances (unlike more readily provable Chrojmim six) and used the law to force city councils to halt fluoridation.

People on this site who preach fluoridation believe that fluoride actually belongs in blood and bone. They are incorrect because fluoride is a contaminant of blood and bone. Of course hexavalent chromium that was measured in blood was key to winning the suit against PG&E. So what? It can be proven that F levels in blood of those living in fluoridated cities are higher than in nonfluoridated cities, but fluoride is not Cr which is recognized as not belonging in blood. So instead, Eein Brockovich is fighting to have fluoride removed from the list of ingredients thought to be part of a normal diet.

Richard Sauerheber, Ph.D.
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