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Re: "I'm Not a Racist"

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Message 11 of 48

@Centristsin2010 wrote:

@jims730656 wrote:

@Centristsin2010 wrote:

@jims730656 wrote:

@Centristsin2010 wrote:

@jims730656 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

"I'm not a racist" or "prove that I'm a racist" are often the first two things that racists say.

 

They often show what they are without ever admitting it. This forum confirms that.


So if you admit you're a racist then of course you are a racist.  But if you say you're NOT a racist, then you are a racist.  And of course if you say 'all (everybody) lives matter'  you're a racist.  I think I see a flaw in this reasoning.

 

  And when you say 'often', how can you, based on those four words alone, determine if the speaker is a rascist or not?

 

 

More than once, I have said online, on Facebook and other venues that I'm not too interested in hearing 'black OR white lives matter" because I strongly believe that EVERYONE, every human being without exception should always  be treated as completely equal as everyone else.  For THAT I have been called a racist.

 

This blanket kind of reasoning makes no sense to me and I feel it's a serious insult to those people who harbor no prejudice to others of a different race yet are ASSUMED to be racists simply becaue they said they believed they weren't.

Please exaplin this reasoning?


Do you know what "Black Lives Matter" means and why it's relevant?


Of course I know what it means Cool.  That's half the challenge.  It really is an reasonable question and if you understand what it mean's, you'll understand why, IMO.  But, if you know what it means, then shouldn't you know why responding with "White Lives Matter" or "All Lives Matter" is tone deaf? 

 

and, for what it's worth, you might be surprised to know that several Conservative posters here didn't know what the slogan meant.  I would suggest those who may be racist are more likely to be bothered by it. 

 

and the fact that I want fair treatment and total equality for everyone doesn't mean I don't understand and appreciate their situation.  OK.  Not sure anyone suggested otherwise, did they?  In fact, if what I want would happen, everybody would be equal and no one would NEED to carry signs reminding people that their lives matter.  Well, that's noble indeed, but guess what?  Everyone IS equal......now and many feel we still need to carry signs reminding others "Hey, Whitie, we matter just as much as you".

 

And is that all you got from that entire post?  Did you miss the honest and valid question asking how you can tell someone is racist merely because they say they are not on the Internet?  I understand this question wasn't directed to me, but I'll take a stab at it....IMO, you can't tell, but smart folks like yourself can get a pretty good idea by the comments they make over an extended period of time. If you did, I'm asking again because I don't buy the claim that everybody is a racist.  Well, you might be surprised.  Maybe not everyone, but a far more than even a smart guy like yourself could imagine.  Consider the fact that there are various degree's of racism, like everything else....it's not you either are or you aren't.

 

Have you ever taken the Harvard implicit test?  It's been posted here probably a half-dozen times or so.....

 

What you may find interesting is that a couple of dozen folks over the years have reported their results here on the forum to share and discuss,  And ALL of them were what most would describe as left of center....not sure what that means, but it is "curious."  If there are any folks who are right of center who posted their results here, my apologies....I must have missed you post.

 

To narrow the point for you, if a man walked up t you with a swastika on his shirt, or was wearing a white robe and pointy hat and said he was not a racist, you would have good reason to question the statement.  But how can you possibly justify thinking someone you don't even know is a racist only because he says so?  These are just words we're using here, written by relative strangers, so not taking anyone at his word without KNOWING that persona is, lets' just say, disingenuous.

 

By the way, thinking "everybody": is racist means that since you are part of 'everybody' then YOU are a racist too,   How does that square with you calling other people racists?  Here's the test if you're interested.....it might answer the question for you.....

 

Harvard Racism Test


You embedded your words in mine, making it difficult to separate them.  Hopefully you have a color monitor.  It makes for easy reading the conversational style.  I find this more effective because you can see what I'm responding to vs. having to guess.  However I'll try but I may miss a few.

 

"Cool.  That's half the challenge.  It really is an reasonable question and if you understand what it mean's, you'll understand why, IMO."

A reasonable question, but in the context of the one asking is seemed more than a little sarcastic.  You misread it....not sarcastic at all.

 

"But, if you know what it means, then shouldn't you know why responding with "White Lives Matter" or "All Lives Matter" is tone deaf? "

Again, context matters.  It depends on intent as much as the words.  Tone deaf for some, misunderstanding for others. I think "misunderstanding" is tone deaf.   I've met a few people here who think they known all about how someone thinks based on a few words, and I don't play that game.  Oh, I agree.

 

"Well, that's noble indeed, but guess what?  Everyone IS equal......now and many feel we still need to carry signs reminding others "Hey, Whitie, we matter just as much as you"."

No, everyone is NOT equal.  You're wrong, IMO.  And that's ok, right?  Are you equal?  Who isn't equal?  The Constitution say's we are all equal and that takes precedence, right? What gives you the right to say some aren't equal?  But certainly some people treat others as less equal....I hope you aren't one of them.  They SHOULD be, but they are not.  Not socially, financially, ability to advance or level of content/happiness and it's institional and not exclusively on one political side.  We're talking equal rights and how people treat others, right?  The Constitution never said all people should have equal things; just equal rights.  We're talking apples and oranges.  Do you think those with less money (your financially comment) should have less rights, different rights?

 

"I understand this question wasn't directed to me, but I'll take a stab at it....IMO, you can't tell, but smart folks like yourself can get a pretty good idea by the comments they make over an extended period of time."

And the pertinent phrase is 'over an extended period of time'.  Far too many people, here and on sites like Facebook very often form an opinion of people based on ONE post in ONE thread and sometimes just a PART of one post in one thread.  Yep.  Just like most do in their everyday lives.  It's where the term bigotry comes into play.

 

In my own case, an example would be my opinion on most things is the same regardless of what thread I'm posting on.  Except for the hypocrites, I believe that's the case for most of the posters here.  But if I should disagree with a liberal on almost anything I'm suddenly a conservative (and sometimes a right winger) and If I disagree with a conservative I'm a left winger. Yep....that's often the case with the extremes of both sides.  Personally, I take great pride in being called a Liberal by some and a Conservative by several others.....that tells me I'm right where I expect to be.... I am neither despite the apparent belief of some people that there are only two choices.  Yep.....a badge of honor.....Those who actually know me know I don't take blanket sides.  That is illogical and counterproductive.  Agreed.  Those who don't know me simply assume without having the common decency of even bothering to ask me what I mean before they form their opinions.  Yeah, well.  It is what it is.....

 

".I must have missed you post."

no you didn't miss it because I never posted anything about this test.  You took this out of context.....it wasn't directed to you....it was directed at any Conservative who posted and of which I missed their response.  It was an extension of kindness to others; not a reason to arch your back.  If you reread what I wrote, it clearly said, "If there are any folks who are right of center who posted their results here, my apologies....I must have missed your post."  I didn't even know about it until now. And I don't need a test to tell me what's in my mind or my heart even if it COULD accurately assess that in some Internet quiz.  I don't think anyone suggested you did, but you do come across as quite defensive.  If you are a schooled individual you've heard about the conscience, the sub-conscious and unconscious.  Do you really know what's in your sub-conscience or unconscious mind?  Do you know what the word "implicit" means?  If so, you might understand how odd you response is.

 

Also, if I took it and posted the answer it would either be ignored or used as a weapon depending on what their preconceived ideas are.  No one suggested you had to post anything....I'm sure many didn't.  That was the point.  But it could provide you with some insight....don't worry....it doesn't hurt.  You may be able to benefit from it.  Who knows?  You won't know until you try it.  But frankly, I don't really care.  Just wanted to provide you with an opportunity to answer your own questions.....

 

But it doesn't matter as it seems asking and responding in a calm, civil way seems to anger enough people to make further discussions here a waste of time.  Don't let it trouble you....everyone is dealing with their own stuff and as we know, some people often interpret what folks post more negatively than what is intended, especially if there is disagreement.  For example, it appears you misinterpreted several things correctly.  For example:

 

1.   There was absolutely NO sarcasm intended in the comment you interpreted as sarcastic;

 

2.   You misunderstood my comment about the text when you said you never posted anything about the test.

 

3.  You responded as if someone suggested you had to post the results....no one made any suggestion.  You imagined it.

 

Maybe even more.......

 

I'd like to say it's been fun, but it hasn't.  As one astute poster noted in this topic, "It's about growth", personal growth.  You get the "fun" from trying to understand, IMO, vs. thinking everyone is disagreeing with you.  I've noticed that in several conversations you've had with others.  I could be wrong....just an observation.

 

Now, just for hits and giggles, how do you interpret "Black Lives Matter"?  It's not a test.


 


Your text comes out as a light purple to me, and against black text they are almost indistinguishable to me because I don't have good eyesight and this isn't a very good monitor.  But the embedded text makes it cumbersome and time consuming.

 

I'm not saying I'm infallible and I readily admit my mistakes.  Perhaps it was just a question but the defensive tone of Chasky's post made it appear that way.

 

As for the test.  I took it later but did not finish it once I got to the graphics part.  Then I took it again to the end but I still don't buy these Internet 'tests'.  For one thing, the results are influenced by the time taken to pick the 'right' one and my eyesight made me take some time to figure some of these signs out.  Some were obvious ( took the first test in the list) but others were new to me and it took a few seconds to figure out.  And one of the reasons the test is bogus is because it doesn't take the test takers abilities into account (pretty ironic for a test about disabled people).  And the switching of the right and left keys midway through the test was pointless and does nothing to assess the true feelings of the taker.

 

As for 'personal growth', it's been my experience that most people over the age pf 60 don't WANT to do any 'growing' (being changing their perspective).

Also, as I am strongly in opposition to BOTH political parties you have to understand that a larger percentage of people disagree with me than followers of either.  I believe this is mainly because most partisans don't usually associate much with supporters of the "other" party on these forums.  Some agree with my POV, but most don't and many in the latter group refuse to answer questions, which are admittedly made to show the logical errors in their beliefs.  And on the Internet, rather than face to face it's easier to just ignore them.

 

This is nothing new as I have been arguing my points since before there was a World Wide Web, on dialup phone line BBSs so I'm quite used to it.

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Re: "I'm Not a Racist"

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Message 12 of 48

Hello ReTiReD51

I wholeheartedly agree with you

 

Sadly I have a Brother that I is Residing in my Home 

That is just like these individuals

 

He is one year younger than me and is Residing in my Home

Because he didn't plan for retirement like I did

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Re: "I'm Not a Racist"

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Message 13 of 48

@ReTiReD51 wrote:

People say rotten crap about each other all the time.

For me the problem is not the crappy words but that the crappy words are used to excuse crappy behavior and choices that some think justifies their base racist instincts as being reasonable.

 

Great point!


"FAKE 45 #illegitimate" read a sign at the Woman's March in Washington DC, January 21, 2017.
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Re: "I'm Not a Racist"

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Message 14 of 48

People say rotten crap about each other all the time.

For me the problem is not the crappy words but that the crappy words are used to excuse crappy behavior and choices that some think justifies their base racist instincts as being reasonable.

 

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Re: "I'm Not a Racist"

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Message 15 of 48

Each of us sees life through their own eyes

Who there Friends and Family are

Who are Neighbors are

 

The question that all of us should ask ourselves is what are we comfortable with and how willing are we to  change

The more you face your fears,the more you grow

Sometimes each of us has to be pushed past our comfort zones, and at times it is very hard

 

We need to talk about each of our personalities.

 Are we Outgoing. Are we Shy

Mostly we are both depending on the circumstances.

 

Remember the more we talk about our fears and our strengths

 

We continue growing in a Positive Way

 

 

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Re: "I'm Not a Racist"

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Message 16 of 48

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@jims730656 wrote:

You ARE Chasky53, aren't you?

 

YOU said 

"I'm not a racist" or "prove that I'm a racist" are often the first two things that racists say.

 

They often show what they are without ever admitting it. This forum confirms that."

 

And that was what I responded to.  I used your own words to form my questions, that apparent;y you have no intention of answering.

I wasn't calling BS on YOU..  Only asking civil questions. 

 

Why do people like you seem to want to turn an serious adult discussion into some kind of slap fight when caught by their own words?  Deflection?  Smokescreen?  Misdirection?


I said the very small and concise words that you quoted and that's it.

I posted:   

"I'm not a racist" or "prove that I'm a racist" are often the first two things that racists say.    - and -    they often show what they are without ever admitting it.

 

You went on a rant including many other things, saying I meant them and I didn't. You said this:  " But if you say you're NOT a racist, then you are a racist.  And of course if you say 'all (everybody) lives matter'  you're a racist."   I never implied any of those things, I never mentioned anything about "all (everybody) lives matter" or anything about it. I never said that "if you say you're not a racist then you are a racist". You saying those things in reference to my posting is disingenuous and is not "responding to the words" that I posted. What I posted doesn't mean any of those things that you claim. If you think they do then you need to brush up on the English language.

 

Why do "people like you" seem to want to twist other's words to mean things that they didn't and turn a discussion into some kind of "slap fight"?  Deflection? Smokescreen? Misdirection?

 

 


On this forum when racism is at issue, Deflection, Smokescreen and Misdirection,  separately - as well as in combination - are much more often than not the Modus Operandi trifecta...

It is essential to remember that both denial and projection have lately been heavily used favorites since Obama was first elected - and - with trump telling lies most of the time now - denial and projection have become everyday standard conservative/republican strategy...

 

So - am I prejudiced - biased - against republican/conservative thinking, dogma, and policy?

 

Why yes, I am indeed...

 

I have been ever since Nixon, his supporters, and Ford conclusively showed the world that Republicans have been consistently demonstrating preference and favoritism for their party over preference and favoritism for their country.

 

 

44>dolt45
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Re: "I'm Not a Racist"

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Message 17 of 48

Jims730656 wrote:

" I've met a few people here who think they known all about how someone thinks based on a few words, and I don't play that game."

________________________________________________________________________________ 

 

Oh but yes you do play that game, you played it in another posting of mine. You took two short sentences that I posted and assumed or interpreted that they meant several other things that they didn't mean at all, and then assumed that those erroneous assumptions of yours were what I was thinking. You were wrong.


"The only thing man learns from history is man learns nothing from history"
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Re: "I'm Not a Racist"

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Message 18 of 48

@jims730656 wrote:

@Centristsin2010 wrote:

@jims730656 wrote:

@Centristsin2010 wrote:

@jims730656 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

"I'm not a racist" or "prove that I'm a racist" are often the first two things that racists say.

 

They often show what they are without ever admitting it. This forum confirms that.


So if you admit you're a racist then of course you are a racist.  But if you say you're NOT a racist, then you are a racist.  And of course if you say 'all (everybody) lives matter'  you're a racist.  I think I see a flaw in this reasoning.

 

  And when you say 'often', how can you, based on those four words alone, determine if the speaker is a rascist or not?

 

 

More than once, I have said online, on Facebook and other venues that I'm not too interested in hearing 'black OR white lives matter" because I strongly believe that EVERYONE, every human being without exception should always  be treated as completely equal as everyone else.  For THAT I have been called a racist.

 

This blanket kind of reasoning makes no sense to me and I feel it's a serious insult to those people who harbor no prejudice to others of a different race yet are ASSUMED to be racists simply becaue they said they believed they weren't.

Please exaplin this reasoning?


Do you know what "Black Lives Matter" means and why it's relevant?


Of course I know what it means Cool.  That's half the challenge.  It really is an reasonable question and if you understand what it mean's, you'll understand why, IMO.  But, if you know what it means, then shouldn't you know why responding with "White Lives Matter" or "All Lives Matter" is tone deaf? 

 

and, for what it's worth, you might be surprised to know that several Conservative posters here didn't know what the slogan meant.  I would suggest those who may be racist are more likely to be bothered by it. 

 

and the fact that I want fair treatment and total equality for everyone doesn't mean I don't understand and appreciate their situation.  OK.  Not sure anyone suggested otherwise, did they?  In fact, if what I want would happen, everybody would be equal and no one would NEED to carry signs reminding people that their lives matter.  Well, that's noble indeed, but guess what?  Everyone IS equal......now and many feel we still need to carry signs reminding others "Hey, Whitie, we matter just as much as you".

 

And is that all you got from that entire post?  Did you miss the honest and valid question asking how you can tell someone is racist merely because they say they are not on the Internet?  I understand this question wasn't directed to me, but I'll take a stab at it....IMO, you can't tell, but smart folks like yourself can get a pretty good idea by the comments they make over an extended period of time. If you did, I'm asking again because I don't buy the claim that everybody is a racist.  Well, you might be surprised.  Maybe not everyone, but a far more than even a smart guy like yourself could imagine.  Consider the fact that there are various degree's of racism, like everything else....it's not you either are or you aren't.

 

Have you ever taken the Harvard implicit test?  It's been posted here probably a half-dozen times or so.....

 

What you may find interesting is that a couple of dozen folks over the years have reported their results here on the forum to share and discuss,  And ALL of them were what most would describe as left of center....not sure what that means, but it is "curious."  If there are any folks who are right of center who posted their results here, my apologies....I must have missed you post.

 

To narrow the point for you, if a man walked up t you with a swastika on his shirt, or was wearing a white robe and pointy hat and said he was not a racist, you would have good reason to question the statement.  But how can you possibly justify thinking someone you don't even know is a racist only because he says so?  These are just words we're using here, written by relative strangers, so not taking anyone at his word without KNOWING that persona is, lets' just say, disingenuous.

 

By the way, thinking "everybody": is racist means that since you are part of 'everybody' then YOU are a racist too,   How does that square with you calling other people racists?  Here's the test if you're interested.....it might answer the question for you.....

 

Harvard Racism Test


You embedded your words in mine, making it difficult to separate them.  Hopefully you have a color monitor.  It makes for easy reading the conversational style.  I find this more effective because you can see what I'm responding to vs. having to guess.  However I'll try but I may miss a few.

 

"Cool.  That's half the challenge.  It really is an reasonable question and if you understand what it mean's, you'll understand why, IMO."

A reasonable question, but in the context of the one asking is seemed more than a little sarcastic.  You misread it....not sarcastic at all.

 

"But, if you know what it means, then shouldn't you know why responding with "White Lives Matter" or "All Lives Matter" is tone deaf? "

Again, context matters.  It depends on intent as much as the words.  Tone deaf for some, misunderstanding for others. I think "misunderstanding" is tone deaf.   I've met a few people here who think they known all about how someone thinks based on a few words, and I don't play that game.  Oh, I agree.

 

"Well, that's noble indeed, but guess what?  Everyone IS equal......now and many feel we still need to carry signs reminding others "Hey, Whitie, we matter just as much as you"."

No, everyone is NOT equal.  You're wrong, IMO.  And that's ok, right?  Are you equal?  Who isn't equal?  The Constitution say's we are all equal and that takes precedence, right? What gives you the right to say some aren't equal?  But certainly some people treat others as less equal....I hope you aren't one of them.  They SHOULD be, but they are not.  Not socially, financially, ability to advance or level of content/happiness and it's institional and not exclusively on one political side.  We're talking equal rights and how people treat others, right?  The Constitution never said all people should have equal things; just equal rights.  We're talking apples and oranges.  Do you think those with less money (your financially comment) should have less rights, different rights?

 

"I understand this question wasn't directed to me, but I'll take a stab at it....IMO, you can't tell, but smart folks like yourself can get a pretty good idea by the comments they make over an extended period of time."

And the pertinent phrase is 'over an extended period of time'.  Far too many people, here and on sites like Facebook very often form an opinion of people based on ONE post in ONE thread and sometimes just a PART of one post in one thread.  Yep.  Just like most do in their everyday lives.  It's where the term bigotry comes into play.

 

In my own case, an example would be my opinion on most things is the same regardless of what thread I'm posting on.  Except for the hypocrites, I believe that's the case for most of the posters here.  But if I should disagree with a liberal on almost anything I'm suddenly a conservative (and sometimes a right winger) and If I disagree with a conservative I'm a left winger. Yep....that's often the case with the extremes of both sides.  Personally, I take great pride in being called a Liberal by some and a Conservative by several others.....that tells me I'm right where I expect to be.... I am neither despite the apparent belief of some people that there are only two choices.  Yep.....a badge of honor.....Those who actually know me know I don't take blanket sides.  That is illogical and counterproductive.  Agreed.  Those who don't know me simply assume without having the common decency of even bothering to ask me what I mean before they form their opinions.  Yeah, well.  It is what it is.....

 

".I must have missed you post."

no you didn't miss it because I never posted anything about this test.  You took this out of context.....it wasn't directed to you....it was directed at any Conservative who posted and of which I missed their response.  It was an extension of kindness to others; not a reason to arch your back.  If you reread what I wrote, it clearly said, "If there are any folks who are right of center who posted their results here, my apologies....I must have missed your post."  I didn't even know about it until now. And I don't need a test to tell me what's in my mind or my heart even if it COULD accurately assess that in some Internet quiz.  I don't think anyone suggested you did, but you do come across as quite defensive.  If you are a schooled individual you've heard about the conscience, the sub-conscious and unconscious.  Do you really know what's in your sub-conscience or unconscious mind?  Do you know what the word "implicit" means?  If so, you might understand how odd you response is.

 

Also, if I took it and posted the answer it would either be ignored or used as a weapon depending on what their preconceived ideas are.  No one suggested you had to post anything....I'm sure many didn't.  That was the point.  But it could provide you with some insight....don't worry....it doesn't hurt.  You may be able to benefit from it.  Who knows?  You won't know until you try it.  But frankly, I don't really care.  Just wanted to provide you with an opportunity to answer your own questions.....

 

But it doesn't matter as it seems asking and responding in a calm, civil way seems to anger enough people to make further discussions here a waste of time.  Don't let it trouble you....everyone is dealing with their own stuff and as we know, some people often interpret what folks post more negatively than what is intended, especially if there is disagreement.  For example, it appears you misinterpreted several things correctly.  For example:

 

1.   There was absolutely NO sarcasm intended in the comment you interpreted as sarcastic;

 

2.   You misunderstood my comment about the text when you said you never posted anything about the test.

 

3.  You responded as if someone suggested you had to post the results....no one made any suggestion.  You imagined it.

 

Maybe even more.......

 

I'd like to say it's been fun, but it hasn't.  As one astute poster noted in this topic, "It's about growth", personal growth.  You get the "fun" from trying to understand, IMO, vs. thinking everyone is disagreeing with you.  I've noticed that in several conversations you've had with others.  I could be wrong....just an observation.

 

Now, just for hits and giggles, how do you interpret "Black Lives Matter"?  It's not a test.


 


"FAKE 45 #illegitimate" read a sign at the Woman's March in Washington DC, January 21, 2017.
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Re: "I'm Not a Racist"

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Message 19 of 48

@jims730656 wrote:

You ARE Chasky53, aren't you?

 

YOU said 

"I'm not a racist" or "prove that I'm a racist" are often the first two things that racists say.

 

They often show what they are without ever admitting it. This forum confirms that."

 

And that was what I responded to.  I used your own words to form my questions, that apparent;y you have no intention of answering.

I wasn't calling BS on YOU..  Only asking civil questions. 

 

Why do people like you seem to want to turn an serious adult discussion into some kind of slap fight when caught by their own words?  Deflection?  Smokescreen?  Misdirection?


I said the very small and concise words that you quoted and that's it.

I posted:   

"I'm not a racist" or "prove that I'm a racist" are often the first two things that racists say.    - and -    they often show what they are without ever admitting it.

 

You went on a rant including many other things, saying I meant them and I didn't. You said this:  " But if you say you're NOT a racist, then you are a racist.  And of course if you say 'all (everybody) lives matter'  you're a racist."   I never implied any of those things, I never mentioned anything about "all (everybody) lives matter" or anything about it. I never said that "if you say you're not a racist then you are a racist". You saying those things in reference to my posting is disingenuous and is not "responding to the words" that I posted. What I posted doesn't mean any of those things that you claim. If you think they do then you need to brush up on the English language.

 

Why do "people like you" seem to want to twist other's words to mean things that they didn't and turn a discussion into some kind of "slap fight"?  Deflection? Smokescreen? Misdirection?

 

 


"The only thing man learns from history is man learns nothing from history"
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Re: "I'm Not a Racist"

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Message 20 of 48

@Centristsin2010 wrote:

@jims730656 wrote:

@Centristsin2010 wrote:

@jims730656 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

"I'm not a racist" or "prove that I'm a racist" are often the first two things that racists say.

 

They often show what they are without ever admitting it. This forum confirms that.


So if you admit you're a racist then of course you are a racist.  But if you say you're NOT a racist, then you are a racist.  And of course if you say 'all (everybody) lives matter'  you're a racist.  I think I see a flaw in this reasoning.

 

  And when you say 'often', how can you, based on those four words alone, determine if the speaker is a rascist or not?

 

 

More than once, I have said online, on Facebook and other venues that I'm not too interested in hearing 'black OR white lives matter" because I strongly believe that EVERYONE, every human being without exception should always  be treated as completely equal as everyone else.  For THAT I have been called a racist.

 

This blanket kind of reasoning makes no sense to me and I feel it's a serious insult to those people who harbor no prejudice to others of a different race yet are ASSUMED to be racists simply becaue they said they believed they weren't.

Please exaplin this reasoning?


Do you know what "Black Lives Matter" means and why it's relevant?


Of course I know what it means Cool.  That's half the challenge.  It really is an reasonable question and if you understand what it mean's, you'll understand why, IMO.  But, if you know what it means, then shouldn't you know why responding with "White Lives Matter" or "All Lives Matter" is tone deaf? 

 

and, for what it's worth, you might be surprised to know that several Conservative posters here didn't know what the slogan meant.  I would suggest those who may be racist are more likely to be bothered by it. 

 

and the fact that I want fair treatment and total equality for everyone doesn't mean I don't understand and appreciate their situation.  OK.  Not sure anyone suggested otherwise, did they?  In fact, if what I want would happen, everybody would be equal and no one would NEED to carry signs reminding people that their lives matter.  Well, that's noble indeed, but guess what?  Everyone IS equal......now and many feel we still need to carry signs reminding others "Hey, Whitie, we matter just as much as you".

 

And is that all you got from that entire post?  Did you miss the honest and valid question asking how you can tell someone is racist merely because they say they are not on the Internet?  I understand this question wasn't directed to me, but I'll take a stab at it....IMO, you can't tell, but smart folks like yourself can get a pretty good idea by the comments they make over an extended period of time. If you did, I'm asking again because I don't buy the claim that everybody is a racist.  Well, you might be surprised.  Maybe not everyone, but a far more than even a smart guy like yourself could imagine.  Consider the fact that there are various degree's of racism, like everything else....it's not you either are or you aren't.

 

Have you ever taken the Harvard implicit test?  It's been posted here probably a half-dozen times or so.....

 

What you may find interesting is that a couple of dozen folks over the years have reported their results here on the forum to share and discuss,  And ALL of them were what most would describe as left of center....not sure what that means, but it is "curious."  If there are any folks who are right of center who posted their results here, my apologies....I must have missed you post.

 

To narrow the point for you, if a man walked up t you with a swastika on his shirt, or was wearing a white robe and pointy hat and said he was not a racist, you would have good reason to question the statement.  But how can you possibly justify thinking someone you don't even know is a racist only because he says so?  These are just words we're using here, written by relative strangers, so not taking anyone at his word without KNOWING that persona is, lets' just say, disingenuous.

 

By the way, thinking "everybody": is racist means that since you are part of 'everybody' then YOU are a racist too,   How does that square with you calling other people racists?  Here's the test if you're interested.....it might answer the question for you.....

 

Harvard Racism Test


You embedded your words in mine, making it difficult to separate them.  However I'll try but I may miss a few.

 

"Cool.  That's half the challenge.  It really is an reasonable question and if you understand what it mean's, you'll understand why, IMO."

A reasonable question, but in the context of the one asking is seemed more than a little sarcastic.

 

"But, if you know what it means, then shouldn't you know why responding with "White Lives Matter" or "All Lives Matter" is tone deaf? "

Again, context matters.  It depends on intent as much as the words.  Tone deaf for some, misunderstanding for others.  I've met a few people here who think they known all about how someone thinks based on a few words, and I don't play that game.

 

"Well, that's noble indeed, but guess what?  Everyone IS equal......now and many feel we still need to carry signs reminding others "Hey, Whitie, we matter just as much as you"."

No, everyone is NOT equal.  They SHOULD be, but they are not.  Not socially, financially, ability to advance or level of content/happiness and it's institional and not exclusively on one political side.

 

"I understand this question wasn't directed to me, but I'll take a stab at it....IMO, you can't tell, but smart folks like yourself can get a pretty good idea by the comments they make over an extended period of time."

And the pertinent phrase is 'over an extended period of time'.  Far too many people, here and on sites like Facebook very often form an opinion of people based on ONE post in ONE thread and sometimes just a PART of one post in one thread.

In my own case, an example would be my opinion on most things is the same regardless of what thread I'm posting on.  But if I should disagree with a liberal on almost anything I'm suddenly a conservative (and sometimes a right winger) and If I disagree with a conservative I'm a left winger.  I am neither despite the apparent belief of some people that there are only two choices.  Those who actually know me know I don't take blanket sides.  That is illogical and counterproductive.  Those who don't know me simply assume without having the common decency of even bothering to ask me what I mean before they form their opinions.

 

".I must have missed you post."

no you didn't miss it because I never posted anything about this test.  I didn't even know about it until now. And I don't need a test to tell me what's in my mind or my heart even if it COULD accurately assess that in some Internet quiz.

Also, if I took it and posted the answer it would either be ignored or used as a weapon depending on what their preconceived ideas are.

 

But it doesn't matter as it seems asking and responding in a calm, civil way seems to anger enough people to make further discussions here a waste of time.

 

 I'd like to say it's been fun, but it hasn't.

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