From travel insurance to fraud protection, AARP has you covered. Take a closer look at your member benefits.

 

Reply
Treasured Social Butterfly
0
Kudos
171
Views

Re: hero or murderer?

171 Views
Message 11 of 47

easyed598:  How hypocritical,especially when the liberals support illegal aliens,open borders and the abolition of ICE.

 

Panj wrote-Quit telling whoppers.-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Apparently you haven`t been listening to your own liberal politicians and many on this board.

Report Inappropriate Content
0
Kudos
171
Views
Trusted Social Butterfly
0
Kudos
171
Views

Re: hero or murderer?

171 Views
Message 12 of 47

easyed598:  How hypocritical,especially when the liberals support illegal aliens,open borders and the abolition of ICE.

 

Quit telling whoppers.

 

pants-on-fire1.jpg

Report Inappropriate Content
0
Kudos
171
Views
Treasured Social Butterfly
0
Kudos
164
Views

Re: hero or murderer?

164 Views
Message 13 of 47

 

H2O wrote-Why do conservatives hate America, democracy, and the rule of law?---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------How hypocritical,especially when the liberals support illegal aliens,open borders and the abolition of ICE.

Report Inappropriate Content
0
Kudos
164
Views
Frequent Social Butterfly
2
Kudos
152
Views

Re: hero or murderer?

152 Views
Message 14 of 47

@rk9152 wrote:

@H2Oh wrote:


I know you'll ignore my point and simply cut and paste your irrelevant question (no one here said we should treat terrorists as criminals except you... making your statement that "some here agree" a complete fallacy) over ... and over ... and over... no matter how many times someone answers you.

Here's a cut&paste for you - any more about your theory about Nazis posting here. That was quite offensive and should be resolved.

 

 


I'm sorry that reading comprehension might be difficult for you -- is English your second language? I'll try to make myself clearer on this matter at hand, because, as you so often remind others, you should stay on topic of the thread.

 

Why do you think "on the battlefield" and secretly taking an unarmed prisoner somewhere private to murder him are the same thing?

Report Inappropriate Content
2
Kudos
152
Views
Valued Social Butterfly
0
Kudos
150
Views

Re: hero or murderer?

150 Views
Message 15 of 47

@TxGrandpa2 wrote:

@nctarheel wrote:

 

That's not that way in MY MILITARY.


Ok, tell us what it was like in YOUR military when under combat conditions.  Give us the benefit of your experiences, so we can understand this incident better.  I'm sure you can describe more about why Golsteyn did what he did.

 


Are you questioning my MILITARY SERVICE again?

 

My use of MY MILITARY was figurative to describe those who DO NOT commit cold-blooded murder.

 

Your comments about Golsteyn being too obvious and speaking on TV or he otherwise might have gotten away with this murder sounds like you are defending his actions.

 

Are you?

Report Inappropriate Content
0
Kudos
150
Views
Treasured Social Butterfly
0
Kudos
153
Views

Re: hero or murderer?

153 Views
Message 16 of 47

@nctarheel wrote:

 

That's not that way in MY MILITARY.


Ok, tell us what it was like in YOUR military when under combat conditions.  Give us the benefit of your experiences, so we can understand this incident better.  I'm sure you can describe more about why Golsteyn did what he did.

 

Report Inappropriate Content
0
Kudos
153
Views
Valued Social Butterfly
1
Kudos
170
Views

Re: hero or murderer?

170 Views
Message 17 of 47

@TxGrandpa2 wrote:

@easyed598 wrote:

I know what conservatives view on this matter ,,,,I just wanted a liberal opinion and you being a non-phantom liberal,your opinion would be appreciated.


Perhaps Golsteyn was a little too obvious about this.  Mostly he shouldn't have admitted it during the interview on FOX.  Even though he was suspected, there was no evidence to charge him.

 

Doubtful he has been the only one in military history that has done the same during wartime, especially under the circumstances.   It is interesting to see the armchair lawyers comments about military standards of conduct.  I recall some of the stories from Vietnam, plus reading of experiences in other wars.


You mean stories like THE MY LAI MASSACRE or maybe one of other 320 war crime incidents substantiated by U.S. Army investigations?

 

Does it make it right, @TxGrandpa2?

 

Sounds like you believe that the perpetrator's only mistake was bragging about it; not the fact that he killed someone in cold blood.

 

That's not that way in MY MILITARY.

Report Inappropriate Content
1
Kudos
170
Views
Valued Social Butterfly
0
Kudos
176
Views

Re: hero or murderer?

176 Views
Message 18 of 47

@gordyfl wrote:

When you are on the battlefield, it is different than being "downtown".

Although even there, we are dealing with people acting in the name of a cause that has declared war on the west.

 

How can you be certain he was acting in the name of a cause that has declared war on "the west"?

Maybe many of them are simply motivated by the foreigners occupying their country - for 17 years.

 

After being deployed to Afghanistan and seeing the violence his unit was helping to inflict, 2nd Lt. Spenser Rapone grew increasingly disillusioned with the military.
Asked to describe what he was seeing in in Afghanistan with his own eyes?


2nd Lt. Spenser Rapone: "In my own unit, I saw no commitment to learning about the Afghan people or trying to understand them or their culture.

It was more about taking pleasure in going out every night and killing people with impunity. Even on nights when we didn't have kinetic engagements, we would just roll up to villages and ransack them; we’d separate women and children, put bags over people's heads, lock them up in flex cuffs.


We’d call them detainees, which is just a euphemism for prisoner, and we’d do this kind of thing every night, even sometimes without proper intelligence. Most of the guys I was with—even and especially the leadership—relished in the fact that we could kill human beings.

So, for me, I was trying to resolve this contradiction because no one over here was threatening freedom or democracy or anything like that.

We were just going in their homes and threatening their villages and were creating nothing but chaos and destruction.
They said if we didn’t like it, we were in the wrong place. Even the army chaplain would give us these kinds of speeches. I remember one time a chaplain said we were about “bringing wrath upon these people,” and I was like, “Wow, these people have some kind of crusader fantasy.” It was pretty unsettling.


I started to think, “If I were a guy in Afghanistan, how would I feel about this?” I think it's no secret that many people in America would take great umbrage if someone was walking through their homes. For me, I couldn't shake the fact that what we were doing was wrong and morally reprehensible."
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Winning hearts and minds is key to winning any foreign war, which is why the actions of one group of soldiers in Afghanistan was so fundamentally damaging to US interests. In 2010, a rogue unit under the command of Staff Sergeant Calvin Gibbs apparently decided that life in an active war zone wasn’t already exciting enough. They set up a “kill team” of guys who’d drive around southern Afghanistan until they came across civilians. Then they’d murder those civilians in cold blood and dress them as Taliban fighters to cover up the killings.

All told, some 15 civilians were killed during the five months that Gibbs’s team was active. The victims included a mentally retarded man and a 15-year-old boy who had been blown up with a grenade. The team sliced off body parts from their murder victims and kept them as trophies.

 

The case was so shocking that it made international headlines and turned even more Afghans against US forces.


Documentary - The Killing Team:

 


Obviously, I cannot swear that the guy was a jihadist but considering he was involved in killing American soldiers while in civilian clothes it is safe to assume he is not a standard member of an army as covered by the Geneva Convention.

Report Inappropriate Content
0
Kudos
176
Views
Valued Social Butterfly
1
Kudos
168
Views

Re: hero or murderer?

168 Views
Message 19 of 47

@Panjandrum wrote:

rk9152:   When you are on the battlefield, it is different than being "downtown".

 

 

OMG rk, that has never occured to me.*laughing*  Nevertheless, I trust that our military can handle any circumstance. Like they always have. I doubt they're sitting around agonizing over how they should classify their opposition.


The urge to giggle has taken you away from the point. There was absolutely no criticism of the military in my "OMB" posts.

Report Inappropriate Content
1
Kudos
168
Views
Treasured Social Butterfly
0
Kudos
172
Views

Re: hero or murderer?

172 Views
Message 20 of 47

When you are on the battlefield, it is different than being "downtown".

Although even there, we are dealing with people acting in the name of a cause that has declared war on the west.

 

How can you be certain he was acting in the name of a cause that has declared war on "the west"?

Maybe many of them are simply motivated by the foreigners occupying their country - for 17 years.

 

After being deployed to Afghanistan and seeing the violence his unit was helping to inflict, 2nd Lt. Spenser Rapone grew increasingly disillusioned with the military.
Asked to describe what he was seeing in in Afghanistan with his own eyes?


2nd Lt. Spenser Rapone: "In my own unit, I saw no commitment to learning about the Afghan people or trying to understand them or their culture.

It was more about taking pleasure in going out every night and killing people with impunity. Even on nights when we didn't have kinetic engagements, we would just roll up to villages and ransack them; we’d separate women and children, put bags over people's heads, lock them up in flex cuffs.


We’d call them detainees, which is just a euphemism for prisoner, and we’d do this kind of thing every night, even sometimes without proper intelligence. Most of the guys I was with—even and especially the leadership—relished in the fact that we could kill human beings.

So, for me, I was trying to resolve this contradiction because no one over here was threatening freedom or democracy or anything like that.

We were just going in their homes and threatening their villages and were creating nothing but chaos and destruction.
They said if we didn’t like it, we were in the wrong place. Even the army chaplain would give us these kinds of speeches. I remember one time a chaplain said we were about “bringing wrath upon these people,” and I was like, “Wow, these people have some kind of crusader fantasy.” It was pretty unsettling.


I started to think, “If I were a guy in Afghanistan, how would I feel about this?” I think it's no secret that many people in America would take great umbrage if someone was walking through their homes. For me, I couldn't shake the fact that what we were doing was wrong and morally reprehensible."
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Winning hearts and minds is key to winning any foreign war, which is why the actions of one group of soldiers in Afghanistan was so fundamentally damaging to US interests. In 2010, a rogue unit under the command of Staff Sergeant Calvin Gibbs apparently decided that life in an active war zone wasn’t already exciting enough. They set up a “kill team” of guys who’d drive around southern Afghanistan until they came across civilians. Then they’d murder those civilians in cold blood and dress them as Taliban fighters to cover up the killings.

All told, some 15 civilians were killed during the five months that Gibbs’s team was active. The victims included a mentally retarded man and a 15-year-old boy who had been blown up with a grenade. The team sliced off body parts from their murder victims and kept them as trophies.

 

The case was so shocking that it made international headlines and turned even more Afghans against US forces.


Documentary - The Killing Team:

 

Report Inappropriate Content
0
Kudos
172
Views
cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 
Users
Announcements

Have a question about AARP membership or benefits? Ask it in the AARP Help Membership forum, Benefits & Discounts forum, or General forum.


multiple white question marks with center red question mark

Top Authors