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Re: Truth Is In The Eye of the Beholder

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Message 11 of 39

@GailL1 wrote:

@ManicProgressive wrote:

@GailL1 wrote:


Well, we are gonna have to start figuring it out - to me, assimilation is the only way - that means assimilation by those who are here and those who come.  Kids knowing kids; mothers knowing mothers, laborers knowing laborers, community gatherings, cook outs, sports and activities - people doing the same things together

 

If we cannot get there - then I just don't know.

 

 


Knowing people is assimilation? This happens now. 


It is better now - just like African Americans and whites here - it is better now.

But it still has a long way to go.  How can we get to know immigrants if they gravitate to area where they are only around people of their own ethnicity/race/culture. 

 

When I drive the 40 miles to my daughters new place - I go through various communities (wall to wall commercial establishments ) - 1st a Hispanic one, then an Asian one - signs on stores all in their own language, even banks, no other translation.   If I was looking to buy a piece of furniture or art or groceries or a piece of clothing - I would not know where to even begin.  The only reason I know the bank is because it has an ATM out front and looks like an ole BOA in design.  Gas stations too are pretty descript with the pumps out front.

These are their communities but that is NOT assimilating.

 

In my closeby community, it is different, we don't have communities of different nationalities - we are all bended in that respect.  The Middle Eastern guys who own the "Country Store" still sell bait and their signs plainly state that fact.  Once they understood the importance of bait to their store, they dove right in to the fishin' retail marketplace with all the American lingo.  Capitalism at its finest.


Sorry Gail, but unfortunately, this very interesting subject turns into a partisan political nature instead of being able to discuss it  in a manner that politcs do not enter into it.

Garden Grove in Ca is an example of the lack of assimilation of the Viet Namese in that area. when you visit that little city there is not one sing in English and people in that area most of them only speak Vietnamese. I loved their stores, restaurants etc, and simply disregard the lack of understanding. Just like in Miami, Calle ocho.  which is a Cuban community in which English is practically unknown. 
I hate to tell you how many cubans have never bother to learn English, because for me is embarrasing. but that is how it is.

Mexicans in Ca.  I hate to remind many that in Ca. I  hadrly spoke english. and I was working for the county. most of the employees were Hispanics and Spanish was practically the language that we spoked in our meetings. sometimes our American co workers would remind us that  they didn't understand what we were saying. and fortunatelly tell us laughing about it.

Gettos are not new in this country. it takes at least a generation for many to really assimilate. whether they are doing it faster or not today is not the issue. is the lack of resources that they encounter when they come to this country that would help them to assimilate.

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Re: Truth Is In The Eye of the Beholder

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Message 12 of 39

@ManicProgressive wrote:

Most immigrants learn English.  And they are learning it more rapidly than prior generations of immigrants.

 

https://www.omaha.com/news/metro/report-newer-generations-of-immigrants-learn-english-quickly-are-le...

 

 

But what exactly are American customs? Getting fat and unhealthy? Walking around with shoes on in the house? Not valuing higher education?  Driving gas guzzlers? 

 

Other than obeying the law, Which everyone must do,  it seems to me people can do as they like. American freedom and all that, right?


You are right on all counts. Immigrants do learn English at a higher rate than ever before, but some are so prejudiced that they won't believe it. Some are so bigoted that they think immigrants to be too dumb to learn English, and many of those struggle to use English properly themselves, let alone learn another language.

 

And what are "our customs" that they should learn? Bigotry, racism, the American freedom to hate others?


"The only thing man learns from history is man learns nothing from history"
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Re: Truth Is In The Eye of the Beholder

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Message 13 of 39

@rker321 wrote:

Sorry Mick  you are wrong in all counts. unfortunately by your post, I can see that you don't understand one word about immigration and the positive and negative factors that exist.
By posting platitutes, you in many ways are saying nothing.


I think Mickstuder is spot-on, he may understand more than you do. IMO, people who are paranoid about immigrants have their own issues and prejudices. Unfounded fears drives a lot of it.


"The only thing man learns from history is man learns nothing from history"
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Re: Truth Is In The Eye of the Beholder

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Message 14 of 39

@GailL1 wrote:

@ManicProgressive wrote:

@GailL1 wrote:


Well, we are gonna have to start figuring it out - to me, assimilation is the only way - that means assimilation by those who are here and those who come.  Kids knowing kids; mothers knowing mothers, laborers knowing laborers, community gatherings, cook outs, sports and activities - people doing the same things together

 

If we cannot get there - then I just don't know.

 

 


Knowing people is assimilation? This happens now. 


It is better now - just like African Americans and whites here - it is better now.

But it still has a long way to go.  How can we get to know immigrants if they gravitate to area where they are only around people of their own ethnicity/race/culture. 

 

When I drive the 40 miles to my daughters new place - I go through various communities (wall to wall commercial establishments ) - 1st a Hispanic one, then an Asian one - signs on stores all in their own language, even banks, no other translation.   If I was looking to buy a piece of furniture or art or groceries or a piece of clothing - I would not know where to even begin.  The only reason I know the bank is because it has an ATM out front and looks like an ole BOA in design.  Gas stations too are pretty descript with the pumps out front.

These are their communities but that is NOT assimilating.

 

In my closeby community, it is different, we don't have communities of different nationalities - we are all bended in that respect.  The Middle Eastern guys who own the "Country Store" still sell bait and their signs plainly state that fact.  Once they understood the importance of bait to their store, they dove right in to the fishin' retail marketplace with all the American lingo.  Capitalism at its finest.


They are assimilating. I think they just aren’t doing it as fast as you’d like.  The existence of a Chinatown or whatever doesn’t mean all immigrants stay there 100% of the time. Many get jobs elsewhere. Many move out. But others move in, so the ethnic neighborhood seems static to outsiders.  It doesn’t mean the people are, though. 

 

 

 

 

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Re: Truth Is In The Eye of the Beholder

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Message 15 of 39

@williamb39198 

 

I would like to read your comments on the subject - read my initial post which started the thread and give us your views on the subject.

* * * * It's Always Something . . . Roseanne Roseannadanna
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Re: Truth Is In The Eye of the Beholder

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Message 16 of 39

We are a nation of immigrants. Most all of our families are rooted in immigration. We have been assimilating over the last few hundred years. Immigrants have added to our culture, are adding, and will continue to add in the future. 

But now we have an administration which says immigration must be stopped. They are basing their policy on 

prejudice, not reality. 

I say we reject the prejudicial view and continue the historical perspective of adding to the quality of our culture. 

 

Country over party

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Re: Truth Is In The Eye of the Beholder

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Message 17 of 39

@ManicProgressive wrote:

@GailL1 wrote:


Well, we are gonna have to start figuring it out - to me, assimilation is the only way - that means assimilation by those who are here and those who come.  Kids knowing kids; mothers knowing mothers, laborers knowing laborers, community gatherings, cook outs, sports and activities - people doing the same things together

 

If we cannot get there - then I just don't know.

 

 


Knowing people is assimilation? This happens now. 


It is better now - just like African Americans and whites here - it is better now.

But it still has a long way to go.  How can we get to know immigrants if they gravitate to area where they are only around people of their own ethnicity/race/culture. 

 

When I drive the 40 miles to my daughters new place - I go through various communities (wall to wall commercial establishments ) - 1st a Hispanic one, then an Asian one - signs on stores all in their own language, even banks, no other translation.   If I was looking to buy a piece of furniture or art or groceries or a piece of clothing - I would not know where to even begin.  The only reason I know the bank is because it has an ATM out front and looks like an ole BOA in design.  Gas stations too are pretty descript with the pumps out front.

These are their communities but that is NOT assimilating.

 

In my closeby community, it is different, we don't have communities of different nationalities - we are all bended in that respect.  The Middle Eastern guys who own the "Country Store" still sell bait and their signs plainly state that fact.  Once they understood the importance of bait to their store, they dove right in to the fishin' retail marketplace with all the American lingo.  Capitalism at its finest.

* * * * It's Always Something . . . Roseanne Roseannadanna
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Re: Truth Is In The Eye of the Beholder

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Message 18 of 39

@mickstuder wrote:

When I went into the Military at Age 18 - I had a lot of prejudices a lot of bias towards specific races...................

 

During training some of this stuff was reinforced because although I didn't realize it at the time a lot of the people I thought I didn't like - didn't like me either & for the same ignorant reasons

 

After landing in Vietnam......................almost all of that went away & I started looking at people not based on looks or colors or language - but whether or not I thought I could trust them

 


I could not agree with you more on the above, mickstuder - but what you are talking about is assimilation and getting to know one another.

People have to get to know people - that is the only thing that is going to reveil our likenesses rather than any perceived differences.

 

Kids being kids, mothers being mothers, laborers being laborers, get-togethers - not some expert telling people that immigration is good for the country.  It has to be on a more personalized level that these types of perceived beliefs go by the wayside.

 

And it is not just one sided either, it has to be a joint effort - Americans and immigrants.

* * * * It's Always Something . . . Roseanne Roseannadanna
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Re: Truth Is In The Eye of the Beholder

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Message 19 of 39

@rker321 wrote:

 

There is nothing that provides that education to new immigrants. they are mostly left to their own devices and most  or the older ones simply remain as they were when they arrived.

 

We need to make this transition better, we need to educate these new immigrants the customs and the culture of the US. Especially the language.
We have made it so  easy for new immigrants to simply not learn anything about this country but what they care to learn by themselves.

 

This is my country, and I want to see immigrants but I want them to see respecting my language, and costumes as much as they expect me to respect theirs.

 

And not forge that if we came here we left our countries behind and need to learn new ways of adapting and assimilation into this country as an obligation of our decision to come here.


If immigrants come through the refugee program, there are non-profits to help them assimilate - housing, English classes, Citizenship classes, kids enrolled in school, help finding a job, etc.

.

But you are right, if they don't come in that way (as refugees) then we are lacking.  The main reason why this happens is because when they come into the country as asylum seekers or TPS (Temporary Protective Status) we don't know if they will ever get refugee status.  So they are left to their own accord and gravitate to areas where they may know people or people which they have a cultural connection.  They are left to find out things on their own or with the help of other in this (relation) community - They might not have to learn English, they might not have help finding a job or even housing.

 

But, rker321 - What is the American culture?  What are American values?

Yes, English as a national language would be good just for good communication but there is so much more -

Things like - Independence, individualism, Equality - Achievement, Action, Work, and Materialism - Directness and Assertiveness

Yea, I like teaching those things too - Is that what you are talking about?  What else?

If you want a good laugh, here is an article written many years ago by a university for their international students and scholars - just scroll down to the part that is titled:  Tips for Social Gatherings

Key American Values -

* * * * It's Always Something . . . Roseanne Roseannadanna
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Re: Truth Is In The Eye of the Beholder

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Message 20 of 39

@GailL1 wrote:

@ManicProgressive wrote:

I like data myself. It calms “my” fears. Like flying on a plane is the safest way to travel. Data helps me. 

 

But I get what you are saying. I don’t know how to allay fears like that. I worry that people fear the country’s change to a majority of people of color stems from worrying minorities will eventually treat us the same way we’ve historically treated them.  The antitdote to that, IMO, is for everyone to recognize how critical it is we work to ensure constitutional rights for all. All ethnicities, all nationalities, all religions, all income levels. Make that goal the American goal. We will have much less to fear as we become the minority....


Well, we are gonna have to start figuring it out - to me, assimilation is the only way - that means assimilation by those who are here and those who come.  Kids knowing kids; mothers knowing mothers, laborers knowing laborers, community gatherings, cook outs, sports and activities - people doing the same things together

 

If we cannot get there - then I just don't know.

 

 


Knowing people is assimilation? This happens now. 

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