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Treasured Social Butterfly
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Re: Trump policy of separating families

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Message 71 of 107

@GailL1 wrote:

@rker321 wrote:

 

So, you see, rker321, although the current policy of separating the children from those who cross the border at those unauthorized places has a farreaching purpose - we have to make sure that these are their children and not just human trafficking.

 

Would it be better if Mexico stopped them and retained them in camps on their side of the border until their situation is actually known?  In that way, they could enter at the proper places and request asylum once it is known who they are and if they belong together and now just some human trafficking ploy..

 

But do they really meet the definition of asylum seekers (resd the definition)?  Seems to me, their country(ies) of origin needs to step up their law enforcement on the Cartel and the gangs wreaking havoc in their homeland.


I guess that when I came here yes you are correct. I came with a valid tourist visa and when entered the US was asked what I wanted to do, My family and I decided that we would request something that it was given at that time which was"indefinite departure"  which allows us to stay in the US indefinitely until we decided to leave. It was not Asylum or refugee status.  The ones that came in the boats yes they were put in detention camps but they didn't suffered separations of their children at that time.
I am going to repeat what I said during the Obama Administration when those unaccompanied children were coming.
Go to the Mexican Government and obtain their  help in stopping at their borders the entrance of these children or families.  Make a deal with Mexico. and that is an avenue that he should seek with Mexico. but now after being "so nice" to the Mexican governent it wouldn't surprise me if at their border they don't receive these people with firecrackers and actually bring them to the border.

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Valued Social Butterfly
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Re: Trump policy of separating families

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Message 72 of 107

@john258 wrote:

@GailL1 wrote:

@Richva wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

The situation is quite clear but gets complicated by posters insisting on using irrational emotionalism to hide logic. Example - if a person comes to a border crossing with  child asking for asylum, they are not separated. But if, instead, they cross illegally, possibly employing a  "coyote" to smuggle them in, different rules apply


Actually, it is when they present themselves to CBP and ask for asylum. The popular technique has been to tell everyone they are taking the children for a bath and the child never comes back. 


rk9152 is correct - asking for asylum has to take place at an authorized border crossing.  Trying to come in at some other location puts suspicion on whomever it is because this is how child smugglers come in.  It is also very dangerous to get entry this way - the very foundation of our immigration laws is to have legally defined access places where everybody is checked and asked for what purpose they arrive.  

 

If they want to ask for asylum and the family kept together, all they have to do is present themselves at an authorized border crossing for the process to begin.  By crossing at an illegal point, there are other steps that have to be completed because the action is suspicious.


Once again you are incorrect. They are separating them at authorized border crossings when they present themselves. This was the new rules put in by the Trump JD. You need to learn this subject also.


No they are not and I have posted links from the Washingpost describing the difference in where they cross into the US.  Here it is again -

WP 04/30/2018 - After a day at the border, first eight members of migrant caravan taken into U.S. cu...

 

Here you have a caravan of asylum seekers - those that remained with the caravan and entered at the legal port of entry - began the process.

 

Those that left the caravan and attempted entry illegally at some other place were treated differently depending upon their situation - some were criminals.

 

. . . . While the main caravan group is waiting to enter through legal channels at the port of entry, the statement said these migrants got picked up crossing into the country illegally elsewhere along the border.

 

. . . . . Alex Mensing, one of the caravan coordinators, said he did not know whether the people charged had been part of the caravan. In legal workshops, the migrants have been told that “crossing anywhere other than a port of entry is a crime that’s prosecutable, and we never encourage anyone to do that,” he said.

 

Alex Mensing, is a US collaborators who works for Pueblo Sin Fronteras,

 

NBC News - Who is Pueblo Sin Fronteras - for over 15 years has led migrants to the U.S. via caravans to help them to seek asylum in other countries.

. . . . The group's volunteers help the migrants stay together to protect themselves from danger along the way, including from criminals and natural elements, but also to move past law enforcement officials.

 

Why not seek asylum in Mexico or some other closer country?  Now we have organizations of these huge caravans with people taught how to legally enter the US correctly for asylum seeking.

 

Why not fix their problems with gangs and crime? 

Why not just go ahead and apply as a refugee and not have to risk the geographical crossing all together?

 

People, something does have to be done about this - we need immigration reform NOW -

 

 

* * * * It's Always Something . . . Roseanne Roseannadanna
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Treasured Social Butterfly
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Re: Trump policy of separating families

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Message 73 of 107

@john258 wrote:


Germany

Is this about Germany and Hitler, or is it about immigration here in the United States?  You keep attempting to make it about Germany and Hitler.  Very much off-topic.

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Re: Trump policy of separating families

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Message 74 of 107

@Olderscout66 wrote:

Example - if a person comes to a border crossing with  child asking for asylum, they are not separated. But if, instead, they cross illegally, possibly employing a  "coyote" to smuggle them in, different rules apply

Repuiblicans would like people to believe that, but its another lie. Before Trump, when a FAMILY was discovered to have entered the country illegally, and they requested political asylum, the entire family was released until a hearing could be held to rule on their asylum request.

 



 If they request asylum at the point of entry they are not separated.  You change that to saying if they are detained after entry.  It's a different thing.  After entry, they are considered to be in the country illegally.  That is where the different rules apply.  The administration is applying the law of criminal entry.

 

Someone asking to come into your house is different from someone who breaks in, then is arrested and prosecuted.  They would be separated from their children then wouldn't they?  But of course that destroys your argument doesn't it?

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Re: Trump policy of separating families

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Message 75 of 107

Illegally crossing the US border is a MISDEMEANOR.

 

Der Trumper is ripping apart immigrant families for something that normally results in no jail time and no fine.

 

But his Republican base is NOT "normal" - they are hate-filled bigots who cannot admit their problems are not caused by someone easy for them to hate - like immigrants - instead of the real cause of their problem - the people who stopped sharing the profits of the business with their workers - rich Republicans.

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Valued Social Butterfly
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Re: Trump policy of separating families

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Message 76 of 107

@CS402050 wrote:

@Olderscout66 wrote:

Example - if a person comes to a border crossing with  child asking for asylum, they are not separated. But if, instead, they cross illegally, possibly employing a  "coyote" to smuggle them in, different rules apply

Repuiblicans would like people to believe that, but its another lie.

Wrong again.  The example above is FACT.


And here is an article to substantiate the FACT -

WP 04/30/2018 - After a day at the border, first eight members of migrant caravan taken into U.S. cu...

 

. . . . Attorney General Jeff Sessions announced Monday that the Justice Department has filed criminal charges against 11 suspected members of the caravan for illegally entering the country, including one who has been deported previously, according to a statement. While the main caravan group is waiting to enter through legal channels at the port of entry, the statement said these migrants got picked up crossing into the country illegally elsewhere along the border.

 

. . . . Alex Mensing, one of the caravan coordinators, said he did not know whether the people charged had been part of the caravan. In legal workshops, the migrants have been told that “crossing anywhere other than a port of entry is a crime that’s prosecutable, and we never encourage anyone to do that,” he said. 

 

The solution is simple - ENTER AT A LEGAL POINT OF ENTRY and begin the process for asylum seeking.

* * * * It's Always Something . . . Roseanne Roseannadanna
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Re: Trump policy of separating families

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Message 77 of 107

@CS402050

How does this “policy” support any compassion for other human beings? Do we lock up our borders and ignore the rest of the world?

And what percentage of immigrants are “bad”?

 

trump / sessions policy

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Valued Social Butterfly
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Re: Trump policy of separating families

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Message 78 of 107

@GailL1 wrote:

@Richva wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

The situation is quite clear but gets complicated by posters insisting on using irrational emotionalism to hide logic. Example - if a person comes to a border crossing with  child asking for asylum, they are not separated. But if, instead, they cross illegally, possibly employing a  "coyote" to smuggle them in, different rules apply


Actually, it is when they present themselves to CBP and ask for asylum. The popular technique has been to tell everyone they are taking the children for a bath and the child never comes back. 


rk9152 is correct - asking for asylum has to take place at an authorized border crossing.  Trying to come in at some other location puts suspicion on whomever it is because this is how child smugglers come in.  It is also very dangerous to get entry this way - the very foundation of our immigration laws is to have legally defined access places where everybody is checked and asked for what purpose they arrive.  

 

If they want to ask for asylum and the family kept together, all they have to do is present themselves at an authorized border crossing for the process to begin.  By crossing at an illegal point, there are other steps that have to be completed because the action is suspicious.


Once again you are incorrect. They are separating them at authorized border crossings when they present themselves. This was the new rules put in by the Trump JD. You need to learn this subject also.

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Re: Trump policy of separating families

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Message 79 of 107

@TxGrandpa2 wrote:

@john258 wrote:


Yes it is fact. It is happening and if you watch TV you will see it first hand. There was a family on that had been separated some time ago, and were released except one child a girl. The family is living in Chicago now, but the child is still being held, and they have not been able to get her released. They do get phone calls from her.


It would be more believable if you furnished a link to source that comment.  Otherwise it is just an unverified anecdote. 

 

Additionally, you are obsessed about comparing the administration to Hitler's rise to power.  He did so in the period after the First World War when Germany was attempting to establish a stable representative government, exacerbated with a depression.

 

So one has to believe that your posts are of a mostly partisan nature.


Only in the mind of a far right enabler is it unverified since they did not get it from their leaders.  One great thing a true fact can not be changed by you or I no matter hard you try. Yes Germany was trying to establish the type of govt. you speak of, and the far right and Hitler were plotting how to use that to move to a dictatorship just like in the US today. The far right enablers under Trump follow the same path. There were people in Germany speaking as I am and other thinking people are today and there were people like you who were speaking as you are. Well the people like you were wrong and they got Hitler in and look what happened. Sad thing is you built your life based on the very things you now want to take away from every American.

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Re: Trump policy of separating families

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Message 80 of 107

@Olderscout66 wrote:

Example - if a person comes to a border crossing with  child asking for asylum, they are not separated. But if, instead, they cross illegally, possibly employing a  "coyote" to smuggle them in, different rules apply

Repuiblicans would like people to believe that, but its another lie.

Wrong again.  The example above is FACT.

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