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Re: Trump Prohibits Pre-Exisiting Conditions Defense

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@mickstuder wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@mickstuder wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@mickstuder wrote:

Unable to nullify the Affordable Care Act (ACA) in Congress, the Trump administration has instead chipped away at the ACA’s foundations in an attempt to effectuate its collapse. That collapse hasn’t happened yet. In fact, ACA exchange market appears to have recovered from last year's doldrums. But, another key ACA pillar is now vulnerable to being eliminated.

 

A lawsuit by 20 U.S. Republican states seeks to invalidate pre-existing condition protections contained in the Affordable Care Act (ACA).

 

A pre-existing condition is any disease or condition for which an applicant for health insurance has sought medical care. The lawsuit also seeks to remove ACA provisions regarding community rating. Here, community rating refers to the setting of insurance premiums without adjusting for a person’s health status.

 

The lawsuit, Texas v. Azar, was filed in February 2018 by Texas and 19 other states. It builds on the recent repeal of the ACA’s individual mandate, which was part of last year’s tax reform law. In the case, the plaintiffs argue that because the mandate was an essential part of the ACA, the entire law should be invalidated.

 

Remarkably, the U.S. Department of Justice stated in a court filing it would not defend ACA in the litigation. In fact, it went further by arguing in a court brief that ACA protections for pre-existing conditions should be ruled unconstitutional.

 

A ruling is not expected until later this year.

 

However, if the 20 states prevail, over 50 million Americans with pre-existing conditions could lose partial or whole coverage, or face much higher premiums.

 

Source - https://www.forbes.com/sites/joshuacohen/2018/10/08/possible-removal-of-pre-existing-conditions-prot...

 

 

 I am all for permitting coverage for babies born with a problem. I am all for insuring that when a person changes insurance companies due to a change in employment. And, no doubt, there are other situations I would approve of pre-existent not being used as a factor.

 

However, take a 47 year old who has been quite capable of purchasing insurance all his working life but opted not to. He is diagnosed with something dire and expensive. What do we do? Do we buy car insurance after the accident? Do we buy homeowner's insurance after the fire?


 


 

 

Does everyone with Car Insurance share the burden of the few who Crash - YES

 

Does everyone with Home Insurance share the burden for the few who's Homes Burn - YES

 

Even having covered people with Pre-existing conditions do Health Insurance Companies make Billions in Profits - YES - Absolutely and it's Obcene to try and Lump Everyone Who Has Ever Been Treated for any Medical Condition into a Category called Pre-existing Conditions

 

A Patient could break their leg in a Car Accident where they had No Fault and now for the Rest of Their Lives They Are Expected to pay Higher Health Insurance Premiums regardless of whether or not after their Broken Leg healed perfectly - ever cost the Health Insurance System another Dime

 

Pre Existing Conditions.png

 

 

Source - https://www.axios.com/profits-are-booming-at-health-insurance-companies-1513302495-18f3710a-c0b4-4ce...

 

 


Many words that evade:

However, take a 47 year old who has been quite capable of purchasing insurance all his working life but opted not to. He is diagnosed with something dire and expensive. What do we do? Do we buy car insurance after the accident? Do we buy homeowner's insurance after the fire?


Many Words That Answered All Your Questions - I threw in the Graph as a Factual Representation and Public Service Announcement

 

Does everyone with Car Insurance share the burden of the few who Crash - YES

 

Does everyone with Home Insurance share the burden for the few who's Homes Burn - YES

 

Even having covered people with Pre-existing conditions do Health Insurance Companies make Billions in Profits - YES - Absolutely and it's Obcene to try and Lump Everyone Who Has Ever Been Treated for any Medical Condition into a Category called Pre-existing Conditions

 

A Patient could break their leg in a Car Accident where they had No Fault and now for the Rest of Their Lives They Are Expected to pay Higher Health Insurance Premiums regardless of whether or not after their Broken Leg healed perfectly - ever cost the Health Insurance System another Dime

Pre Existing Conditions.png

 

 

 Once again words and charts to avoid the issue of the person who for many years opted to not insure himself but when he needs care he expects others who have been taking care of their own needs to pay for him.

 

Do you really consider that to be acceptable??

 


 

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Re: Trump Prohibits Pre-Exisiting Conditions Defense

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Message 2 of 21

I just don't see the ACA going away. Sure, the insurance profiteers want a larger piece of the pie, but they won't let their members of Congress get rid of it.

 

medicare all.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Re: Trump Prohibits Pre-Exisiting Conditions Defense

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Message 3 of 21

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

@mickstuder wrote:

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

I'm thinking about calling an auto insurance company and since I just had a crash, I'm requesting that they cover me for this crash or, my home is on fire and I must call the fire department but first I must call the insurance company to get fire coverage.  Most companies are NOT too anxious to sell you any form of insurance once you have had a claim and for health insurance the claim could be astronomical and ongoing.

 

I don't have a solution for this problem but understand it.


Please let us know how they respond......................

 

Because you're purposely talking about Apples & Lug Wrenches to mislead

Apples to apples.

 

If you already have Fire Insurance and you file a claim - does the Home Insurance Provider completely remove you entirely from your existing policy and put you in a Special New High Risk Group that includes people who are Arsonists & people who have had multiple suspicious Fire Related Claims due to negligence?

I like many other seniors have my home paid for and if I choose to gamble and not have homeowners insurance (I don't do this), I can't pick up the phone during the fire and get insurance. Apples to apples!

 

Same thing with your Car Insurance Company - if you already have Vehicle Insurance and you file a claim for a small Fender Bender - does the Car Insurance Company completely remove you entirely from your existing policy and put you in a High Risk Group with the people who have multiple DWI's Multiple Vehcular Homicide - Suspicious Vehicle Damage Claims - Multiple

Accidents and Vehicle Thefts

 I could get car insurance to legally obtain my registration and then cancel after one month or not make the monthly payments. In that case (where I have cancelled the policy), if I crash my car, in your make believe world I would just call up the insurance company and say "I just had an accident and want to renew my policy" and they would be happy to comply! Apples to apples!

The Current Practice of Penalizing people for filing claims by raising their premiums is absurd enough

 

What is Insurance for - if when you need it - you use it - you get penalized?

 

But putting people with High Blood Pressue in the Same Group with people who require 24/7 Medical Care for Decades is Barbarian & Corrupt

 

We just had a horrible Hurricane that caused billions in damage and loss of life in Florida and 6 other states

For those with no homeowners coverage, you would allow them to call up Allstate and renew retroactively so they had coverage?????

 

The people who had losses are going to rebuild - are they put in a Special High Risk Category because they choose to live in areas that a prone to repeated Floods and Storm Damage

 

How could anyone possibly afford that coverage?

I don't know either but cost is usually proportional to risk!

 

But you want people who through No Fault of Their Own get sick to be basically be left to die

No I don't either. I said I don't have the solution and you don't either.

 

This is the Republican Party this is Trump & The Trump Cult

 The Obama/Hillary cult says throw everyone in the same pool and those that can afford to pay, will pay in spades. Those that can't afford to pay get their premiums paid by those that can. This results in a system that those that can afford to pay, won't and will pay for their own medical costs out of their own pocket. The ultimate result is failure.

 

 

 

 

 


 


Apples and Lug Wrenches - I never said described or insinuated anything remotely close to your analogies

 

The Existing Conditions Debate is not about Patients who have No Insurance and then expect they can go get insurance and be covered retroactively

 

Thats the argument you're trying to make ..............as a Diversion from the facts

 

The US Law Today States - You cannot deny people coverage because of Pre-existing conditions

 

Trump & the GOP are trying to change that Law to include not just those who have no insurance and want insurance

 

But also for Everyone who already has insurance and the minute they use it for any Disease Accident or Illness

 

In the Future they can be denied coverage because of it

 

Thats absurd and your Analogies do not come even close to describing what the issue is

 

Again - we are talking about people like me who have health care insurance and if I dare file a claim for anything - I can be refused future treatment/coverage

 

Thats the issue and I believe you already know that!

 

 

 

 

 

 

( " China if You're Listening - Get Trumps Tax Returns " )

" )
" - Anonymous

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Re: Trump Prohibits Pre-Exisiting Conditions Defense

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Message 4 of 21

@mickstuder wrote:

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

I'm thinking about calling an auto insurance company and since I just had a crash, I'm requesting that they cover me for this crash or, my home is on fire and I must call the fire department but first I must call the insurance company to get fire coverage.  Most companies are NOT too anxious to sell you any form of insurance once you have had a claim and for health insurance the claim could be astronomical and ongoing.

 

I don't have a solution for this problem but understand it.


Please let us know how they respond......................

 

Because you're purposely talking about Apples & Lug Wrenches to mislead

Apples to apples.

 

If you already have Fire Insurance and you file a claim - does the Home Insurance Provider completely remove you entirely from your existing policy and put you in a Special New High Risk Group that includes people who are Arsonists & people who have had multiple suspicious Fire Related Claims due to negligence?

I like many other seniors have my home paid for and if I choose to gamble and not have homeowners insurance (I don't do this), I can't pick up the phone during the fire and get insurance. Apples to apples!

 

Same thing with your Car Insurance Company - if you already have Vehicle Insurance and you file a claim for a small Fender Bender - does the Car Insurance Company completely remove you entirely from your existing policy and put you in a High Risk Group with the people who have multiple DWI's Multiple Vehcular Homicide - Suspicious Vehicle Damage Claims - Multiple

Accidents and Vehicle Thefts

 I could get car insurance to legally obtain my registration and then cancel after one month or not make the monthly payments. In that case (where I have cancelled the policy), if I crash my car, in your make believe world I would just call up the insurance company and say "I just had an accident and want to renew my policy" and they would be happy to comply! Apples to apples!

The Current Practice of Penalizing people for filing claims by raising their premiums is absurd enough

 

What is Insurance for - if when you need it - you use it - you get penalized?

 

But putting people with High Blood Pressue in the Same Group with people who require 24/7 Medical Care for Decades is Barbarian & Corrupt

 

We just had a horrible Hurricane that caused billions in damage and loss of life in Florida and 6 other states

For those with no homeowners coverage, you would allow them to call up Allstate and renew retroactively so they had coverage?????

 

The people who had losses are going to rebuild - are they put in a Special High Risk Category because they choose to live in areas that a prone to repeated Floods and Storm Damage

 

How could anyone possibly afford that coverage?

I don't know either but cost is usually proportional to risk!

 

But you want people who through No Fault of Their Own get sick to be basically be left to die

No I don't either. I said I don't have the solution and you don't either.

 

This is the Republican Party this is Trump & The Trump Cult

 The Obama/Hillary cult says throw everyone in the same pool and those that can afford to pay, will pay in spades. Those that can't afford to pay get their premiums paid by those that can. This results in a system that those that can afford to pay, won't and will pay for their own medical costs out of their own pocket. The ultimate result is failure.

 

 

 

 

 


 

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Re: Trump Prohibits Pre-Exisiting Conditions Defense

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Message 5 of 21

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

I'm thinking about calling an auto insurance company and since I just had a crash, I'm requesting that they cover me for this crash or, my home is on fire and I must call the fire department but first I must call the insurance company to get fire coverage.  Most companies are NOT too anxious to sell you any form of insurance once you have had a claim and for health insurance the claim could be astronomical and ongoing.

 

I don't have a solution for this problem but understand it.


Please let us know how they respond......................

 

Because you're purposely talking about Apples & Lug Wrenches to mislead

 

If you already have Fire Insurance and you file a claim - does the Home Insurance Provider completely remove you entirely from your existing policy and put you in a Special New High Risk Group that includes people who are Arsonists & people who have had multiple suspicious Fire Related Claims due to negligence?

 

Same thing with your Car Insurance Company - if you already have Vehicle Insurance and you file a claim for a small Fender Bender - does the Car Insurance Company completely remove you entirely from your existing policy and put you in a High Risk Group with the people who have multiple DWI's Multiple Vehcular Homicide - Suspicious Vehicle Damage Claims - Multiple

Accidents and Vehicle Thefts

 

The Current Practice of Penalizing people for filing claims by raising their premiums is absurd enough

 

What is Insurance for - if when you need it - you use it - you get penalized?

 

But putting people with High Blood Pressue in the Same Group with people who require 24/7 Medical Care for Decades is Barbarian & Corrupt

 

We just had a horrible Hurricane that caused billions in damage and loss of life in Florida and 6 other states

 

The people who had losses are going to rebuild - are they put in a Special High Risk Category because they choose to live in areas that a prone to repeated Floods and Storm Damage

 

How could anyone possibly afford that coverage?

 

But you want people who through No Fault of Their Own get sick to be basically be left to die

 

This is the Republican Party this is Trump & The Trump Cult

 

 

 

 

 

 

( " China if You're Listening - Get Trumps Tax Returns " )

" )
" - Anonymous

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Trump Prohibits Pre-Exisiting Conditions Defense

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Message 6 of 21

This is an extremely important issue. The last study I saw said 1 out of every 2 Americans (50%) have pre-existing health conditions. We're not talking about only 10% of the population, this is a nationwide concern.

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Re: Trump Prohibits Pre-Exisiting Conditions Defense

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Message 7 of 21

I'm thinking about calling an auto insurance company and since I just had a crash, I'm requesting that they cover me for this crash or, my home is on fire and I must call the fire department but first I must call the insurance company to get fire coverage.  Most companies are NOT too anxious to sell you any form of insurance once you have had a claim and for health insurance the claim could be astronomical and ongoing.

 

I don't have a solution for this problem but understand it.

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Re: Trump Prohibits Pre-Exisiting Conditions Defense

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Message 8 of 21

@rk9152 wrote:

@mickstuder wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@mickstuder wrote:

Unable to nullify the Affordable Care Act (ACA) in Congress, the Trump administration has instead chipped away at the ACA’s foundations in an attempt to effectuate its collapse. That collapse hasn’t happened yet. In fact, ACA exchange market appears to have recovered from last year's doldrums. But, another key ACA pillar is now vulnerable to being eliminated.

 

A lawsuit by 20 U.S. Republican states seeks to invalidate pre-existing condition protections contained in the Affordable Care Act (ACA).

 

A pre-existing condition is any disease or condition for which an applicant for health insurance has sought medical care. The lawsuit also seeks to remove ACA provisions regarding community rating. Here, community rating refers to the setting of insurance premiums without adjusting for a person’s health status.

 

The lawsuit, Texas v. Azar, was filed in February 2018 by Texas and 19 other states. It builds on the recent repeal of the ACA’s individual mandate, which was part of last year’s tax reform law. In the case, the plaintiffs argue that because the mandate was an essential part of the ACA, the entire law should be invalidated.

 

Remarkably, the U.S. Department of Justice stated in a court filing it would not defend ACA in the litigation. In fact, it went further by arguing in a court brief that ACA protections for pre-existing conditions should be ruled unconstitutional.

 

A ruling is not expected until later this year.

 

However, if the 20 states prevail, over 50 million Americans with pre-existing conditions could lose partial or whole coverage, or face much higher premiums.

 

Source - https://www.forbes.com/sites/joshuacohen/2018/10/08/possible-removal-of-pre-existing-conditions-prot...

 

 

 I am all for permitting coverage for babies born with a problem. I am all for insuring that when a person changes insurance companies due to a change in employment. And, no doubt, there are other situations I would approve of pre-existent not being used as a factor.

 

However, take a 47 year old who has been quite capable of purchasing insurance all his working life but opted not to. He is diagnosed with something dire and expensive. What do we do? Do we buy car insurance after the accident? Do we buy homeowner's insurance after the fire?


 


 

 

Does everyone with Car Insurance share the burden of the few who Crash - YES

 

Does everyone with Home Insurance share the burden for the few who's Homes Burn - YES

 

Even having covered people with Pre-existing conditions do Health Insurance Companies make Billions in Profits - YES - Absolutely and it's Obcene to try and Lump Everyone Who Has Ever Been Treated for any Medical Condition into a Category called Pre-existing Conditions

 

A Patient could break their leg in a Car Accident where they had No Fault and now for the Rest of Their Lives They Are Expected to pay Higher Health Insurance Premiums regardless of whether or not after their Broken Leg healed perfectly - ever cost the Health Insurance System another Dime

 

Pre Existing Conditions.png

 

 

Source - https://www.axios.com/profits-are-booming-at-health-insurance-companies-1513302495-18f3710a-c0b4-4ce...

 

 


Many words that evade:

However, take a 47 year old who has been quite capable of purchasing insurance all his working life but opted not to. He is diagnosed with something dire and expensive. What do we do? Do we buy car insurance after the accident? Do we buy homeowner's insurance after the fire?


Many Words That Answered All Your Questions - I threw in the Graph as a Factual Representation and Public Service Announcement

 

Does everyone with Car Insurance share the burden of the few who Crash - YES

 

Does everyone with Home Insurance share the burden for the few who's Homes Burn - YES

 

Even having covered people with Pre-existing conditions do Health Insurance Companies make Billions in Profits - YES - Absolutely and it's Obcene to try and Lump Everyone Who Has Ever Been Treated for any Medical Condition into a Category called Pre-existing Conditions

 

A Patient could break their leg in a Car Accident where they had No Fault and now for the Rest of Their Lives They Are Expected to pay Higher Health Insurance Premiums regardless of whether or not after their Broken Leg healed perfectly - ever cost the Health Insurance System another Dime

Pre Existing Conditions.png

 

 

 

 

( " China if You're Listening - Get Trumps Tax Returns " )

" )
" - Anonymous

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Re: Trump Prohibits Pre-Exisiting Conditions Defense

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Message 9 of 21

@mickstuder wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@mickstuder wrote:

Unable to nullify the Affordable Care Act (ACA) in Congress, the Trump administration has instead chipped away at the ACA’s foundations in an attempt to effectuate its collapse. That collapse hasn’t happened yet. In fact, ACA exchange market appears to have recovered from last year's doldrums. But, another key ACA pillar is now vulnerable to being eliminated.

 

A lawsuit by 20 U.S. Republican states seeks to invalidate pre-existing condition protections contained in the Affordable Care Act (ACA).

 

A pre-existing condition is any disease or condition for which an applicant for health insurance has sought medical care. The lawsuit also seeks to remove ACA provisions regarding community rating. Here, community rating refers to the setting of insurance premiums without adjusting for a person’s health status.

 

The lawsuit, Texas v. Azar, was filed in February 2018 by Texas and 19 other states. It builds on the recent repeal of the ACA’s individual mandate, which was part of last year’s tax reform law. In the case, the plaintiffs argue that because the mandate was an essential part of the ACA, the entire law should be invalidated.

 

Remarkably, the U.S. Department of Justice stated in a court filing it would not defend ACA in the litigation. In fact, it went further by arguing in a court brief that ACA protections for pre-existing conditions should be ruled unconstitutional.

 

A ruling is not expected until later this year.

 

However, if the 20 states prevail, over 50 million Americans with pre-existing conditions could lose partial or whole coverage, or face much higher premiums.

 

Source - https://www.forbes.com/sites/joshuacohen/2018/10/08/possible-removal-of-pre-existing-conditions-prot...

 

 

 I am all for permitting coverage for babies born with a problem. I am all for insuring that when a person changes insurance companies due to a change in employment. And, no doubt, there are other situations I would approve of pre-existent not being used as a factor.

 

However, take a 47 year old who has been quite capable of purchasing insurance all his working life but opted not to. He is diagnosed with something dire and expensive. What do we do? Do we buy car insurance after the accident? Do we buy homeowner's insurance after the fire?


 


 

 

Does everyone with Car Insurance share the burden of the few who Crash - YES

 

Does everyone with Home Insurance share the burden for the few who's Homes Burn - YES

 

Even having covered people with Pre-existing conditions do Health Insurance Companies make Billions in Profits - YES - Absolutely and it's Obcene to try and Lump Everyone Who Has Ever Been Treated for any Medical Condition into a Category called Pre-existing Conditions

 

A Patient could break their leg in a Car Accident where they had No Fault and now for the Rest of Their Lives They Are Expected to pay Higher Health Insurance Premiums regardless of whether or not after their Broken Leg healed perfectly - ever cost the Health Insurance System another Dime

 

Pre Existing Conditions.png

 

 

Source - https://www.axios.com/profits-are-booming-at-health-insurance-companies-1513302495-18f3710a-c0b4-4ce...

 

 


Many words that evade:

However, take a 47 year old who has been quite capable of purchasing insurance all his working life but opted not to. He is diagnosed with something dire and expensive. What do we do? Do we buy car insurance after the accident? Do we buy homeowner's insurance after the fire?

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Re: Trump Prohibits Pre-Exisiting Conditions Defense

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Message 10 of 21

Der Trumper and the two Republican controlled Houses of Congress could not kill PPACA, so now they will use the courts to legislate for them.

 

The mindless base of the GOP will cheer until their health insurance goes away (very shortly after the Insurance Companies win in court), but by then it will be much too late - the Gerrymander and voter suppression will have been declared Constitutional by the Nazi Five, and Democracy will have ended in America...

UNLESS there's no longer a GOP Majority in both Houses of Congress.

 

VOTE OUT THE NRAGOP - SAVE DEMOCRACY FOR YOUR KIDS

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