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Re: Trump Isn’t Impeached Until the House Tells the Senate

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Message 21 of 56

@jimc91 wrote:

Trump Isn’t Impeached Until the House Tells the Senate

According to the Constitution, impeachment is a process, not a vote. 

 

By:  Noah Feldman

 

Now that the House of Representatives has voted to impeach President Donald Trump, what is the constitutional status of the two articles of impeachment? Must they be transmitted to the Senate to trigger a trial, or could they be held back by the House until the Senate decides what the trial will look like, as Speaker Nancy Pelosi has hinted?

 
 

The Constitution doesn’t say how fast the articles must go to the Senate. Some modest delay is not inconsistent with the Constitution, or how both chambers usually work.

 
 

But an indefinite delay would pose a serious problem. Impeachment as contemplated by the Constitution does not consist merely of the vote by the House, but of the process of sending the articles to the Senate for trial. Both parts are necessary to make an impeachment under the Constitution: The House must actually send the articles and send managers to the Senate to prosecute the impeachment. And the Senate must actually hold a trial.

 
 

If the House does not communicate its impeachment to the Senate, it hasn’t actually impeached the president. If the articles are not transmitted, Trump could legitimately say that he wasn’t truly impeached at all.

 
 

That’s because “impeachment” under the Constitution means the House sending its approved articles of to the Senate, with House managers standing up in the Senate and saying the president is impeached.

 

As for the headlines we saw after the House vote saying, “TRUMP IMPEACHED,” those are a media shorthand, not a technically correct legal statement. So far, the House has voted to impeach (future tense) Trump. He isn’t impeached (past tense) until the articles go to the Senate and the House members deliver the message.

 
 

Once the articles are sent, the Senate has a constitutional duty to hold a trial on the impeachment charges presented. Failure for the Senate to hold a trial after impeachment would deviate from the Constitution’s clear expectation.

 

For the House to vote “to impeach” without ever sending the articles of impeachment to the Senate for trial would also deviate from the constitutional protocol. It would mean that the president had not genuinely been impeached under the Constitution; and it would also deny the president the chance to defend himself in the Senate that the Constitution provides.

 

The relevant constitutional provisions are brief. Article I gives the House “the sole power of impeachment.” And it gives the Senate “the sole power to try all impeachments.” Article II says that the president “shall be removed from office on impeachment for, and conviction of, treason, bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors.”

 

Putting these three different provisions together yields the conclusion that the only way to remove the president while he is in office is if the House impeaches him and the Senate tries and convicts him.

The provisions say nothing about timing. Taken literally, they don’t directly say that articles of impeachment passed by the House must be sent to the Senate. But the framers’ definition of impeachment assumed that impeachment was a process, not just a House vote.

 

The framers drafted the constitutional provisions against the backdrop of impeachment as it had been practiced in England, where the House of Commons impeached and the House of Lords tried the impeachments. The whole point of impeachment by the Commons was for the charges of impeachment to be brought against the accused in the House of Lords.

 

Strictly speaking, “impeachment” occurred – and occurs -- when the articles of impeachment are presented to the Senate for trial. And at that point, the Senate is obliged by the Constitution to hold a trial.

 

What would make that trial fair is a separate question, one that deserves its own discussion. But we can say with some confidence that only the Senate is empowered to judge the fairness of its own trial – that’s what the “sole power to try all impeachments” means.

 

If the House votes to “impeach” but doesn’t send the articles to the Senate or send impeachment managers there to carry its message, it hasn’t directly violated the text of the Constitution. But the House would be acting against the implicit logic of the Constitution’s description of impeachment.

A president who has been genuinely impeached must constitutionally have the opportunity to defend himself before the Senate. That’s built into the constitutional logic of impeachment, which demands a trial before removal.

 

To be sure, if the House just never sends its articles of impeachment to the Senate, there can be no trial there. That’s what the “sole power to impeach” means. 

 

But if the House never sends the articles, then Trump could say with strong justification that he was never actually impeached. And that’s probably not the message Congressional Democrats are hoping to send.

 

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++=

 

Yes, this was written by Noah Feldman, one of the dimms star witnesses during the sham one sided hearings.  

 

You can't make this stuff up, we still have a Constitution.  

 

This is hilarious and is another indicator Nancy has gone full nutter...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


You better go read the article again. Toward the end he takes that back and leaves it to history as there is no such requirement or time line to send it over to the Senate. Trump was impeached by the house and will have that noted in history. Nixon was impeached but quit before a trial could be held.

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Re: Trump Isn’t Impeached Until the House Tells the Senate

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Message 22 of 56

@Snoopy48 

Probably because trump is caught up in so many lies and with so many liars, he has no one that can exonerate him!

Isn't it crazy how trump and his followers 

will twist truth, facts, and reality. trump was Impeached legally by the House...

they just can't live it!

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Re: Trump Isn’t Impeached Until the House Tells the Senate

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Message 23 of 56

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

@Snoopy48 wrote:

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

Name the indiivdual who BLOCKED all of the key witnesses from testifying before the House.

 

Individual(s) were: Adam Schiff, Jerry Nadler, and Nancy Pelosi

"The Constitution gives the House of Representatives the sole power to impeach an official"

 

While the Constitution gives the Senate the sole powers of making the rules up (which includes providing the witnesses similar to the House) and convicting (or NOT convicting)!


You really need to get up to speed on the impeachment inquiry. I was Donald J. Trump who BLOCKED key witnesses from testifying. Would anyone refuse to allow someone to testify if that person would definitely exonerate them?


I'm sure that Trump also approved of ONLY 4 Democrat witnesses testifying at the House impeachment fiasco?  Your query would best be put to Adam Schiff who didn't want any Conservatives testifying.



@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

@Snoopy48 wrote:

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

Name the indiivdual who BLOCKED all of the key witnesses from testifying before the House.

 

Individual(s) were: Adam Schiff, Jerry Nadler, and Nancy Pelosi

"The Constitution gives the House of Representatives the sole power to impeach an official"

 

While the Constitution gives the Senate the sole powers of making the rules up (which includes providing the witnesses similar to the House) and convicting (or NOT convicting)!


You really need to get up to speed on the impeachment inquiry. I was Donald J. Trump who BLOCKED key witnesses from testifying. Would anyone refuse to allow someone to testify if that person would definitely exonerate them?


I'm sure that Trump also approved of ONLY 4 Democrat witnesses testifying at the House impeachment fiasco?  Your query would best be put to Adam Schiff who didn't want any Conservatives testifying.


There were many Trump lackeys subpoenaed who were blocked by Trump. Trump was also offered multiple chances to testify. It wasn't Schiff or any other Democratic Representative that prevented Conservatives from testifying.

 

Why wouldn't Trump want those who would 'totally exonerate him' to testify?

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Re: Trump Isn’t Impeached Until the House Tells the Senate

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Message 24 of 56

@LouLit01 wrote:

Every day I wander over to the Fox News site and read the comments after the stories. I've done this since Trump was elected. You can imagine (or maybe you can't) the nonsense I've heard.

 

But now I can't do it anymore. They are constantly insisting Trump isn't impeached. It's amazing. You can't talk sense to them. All you have to do is type, "Is Trump impeached?" into any search engine. That's all. But they refuse to learn how their government works. 

 

 

 

I saw on one of the regular channels a video in which the guy was interviewing at a Trump rally outside and he was asking questions about impeachment. It was  so funny. the ignorance of those people that were interviewed was pathetic. I am so sorry that only those individuals  with a low education feel that they are the base of the Republican Party. 

 

 

 

 

 

 



no name
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Trump Isn’t Impeached Until the House Tells the Senate

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Message 25 of 56

Those who reside in Trump World inhabit an alternate reality where the truth and facts do not exist. Every objective person knows it was Comrade Trump who prevented (blocked) everyone around him from testifying during the impeachment hearings.

 

Criminal investigators know and understand that innocent people cooperate fully, while the guilty party does everything he can to block/impede the investigation. If Trump did nothing wrong, as he claimed, why did he do everything he could to BLOCK the investigation? Unless you're a Trump Cult member, the answer is obvious.

 

Hence, he was charged with Obstructing Congress.

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Re: Trump Isn’t Impeached Until the House Tells the Senate

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Message 26 of 56

@Snoopy48 wrote:

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

Name the indiivdual who BLOCKED all of the key witnesses from testifying before the House.

 

Individual(s) were: Adam Schiff, Jerry Nadler, and Nancy Pelosi

"The Constitution gives the House of Representatives the sole power to impeach an official"

 

While the Constitution gives the Senate the sole powers of making the rules up (which includes providing the witnesses similar to the House) and convicting (or NOT convicting)!


You really need to get up to speed on the impeachment inquiry. I was Donald J. Trump who BLOCKED key witnesses from testifying. Would anyone refuse to allow someone to testify if that person would definitely exonerate them?


I'm sure that Trump also approved of ONLY 4 Democrat witnesses testifying at the House impeachment fiasco?  Your query would best be put to Adam Schiff who didn't want any Conservatives testifying.

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Re: Trump Isn’t Impeached Until the House Tells the Senate

461 Views
Message 27 of 56

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

Name the indiivdual who BLOCKED all of the key witnesses from testifying before the House.

 

Individual(s) were: Adam Schiff, Jerry Nadler, and Nancy Pelosi

"The Constitution gives the House of Representatives the sole power to impeach an official"

 

While the Constitution gives the Senate the sole powers of making the rules up (which includes providing the witnesses similar to the House) and convicting (or NOT convicting)!


You really need to get up to speed on the impeachment inquiry. I was Donald J. Trump who BLOCKED key witnesses from testifying. Would anyone refuse to allow someone to testify if that person would definitely exonerate them?

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Re: Trump Isn’t Impeached Until the House Tells the Senate

455 Views
Message 28 of 56

Name the indiivdual who BLOCKED all of the key witnesses from testifying before the House.

 

Individual(s) were: Adam Schiff, Jerry Nadler, and Nancy Pelosi

"The Constitution gives the House of Representatives the sole power to impeach an official"

 

While the Constitution gives the Senate the sole powers of making the rules up (which includes providing the witnesses similar to the House) and convicting (or NOT convicting)!

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Re: Trump Isn’t Impeached Until the House Tells the Senate

452 Views
Message 29 of 56

This is just a frivolous distraction, brittle straw, and moot argument.  Even IF the House never sent the articles over to the Senate, the legacy of IMPOTUS has a big indelible smudge on it forever and ever.  IMPOTUS has made his black mark on history.  

 

  • 3rd U.S. president ordered impeached blackmark.jpeg

 

 

And it's killing IMPOTUS.  Witness his very public meltdown on a daily basis on Twitter.  🤪

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Trump Isn’t Impeached Until the House Tells the Senate

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Message 30 of 56

Name the President who:

  • hired 6, and soon to be 7, CONVICTED FELONS in his campaign and administration
  • is a PATHOLOGICAL LIAR
  • sends LOVE letters to brutal North Korean dictator Kim Jong Un
  • was cited for 10 possible Obstruction of Justice cases in the Mueller Report
  • is currently under investgiation by the SDNY for Campaign Fraud
  • takes the word of Vladimir Putin over U.S. Intelligence Agencies
  • was impeached by the House for "Abuse of Power"
  • was mpeached by the House for "Obstruction of Congress"
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