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Treasury Announces Steps To Wind Down myRA Program

Too bad - guess people have either found other ways to save for retirement or have decided NOT to save for retirement.

 

Sure glad I didn't think along those lines.  Being self-employed for the majority of my working years, there was no employer match but some of the retirement tax vehicles really helped - 

 

Too bad people don't take advantage of the savers tax credit on their returns.

 

Think people will ever understand that someday they may not be working but living expenses keep coming in and keep getting higher.  Seems like most folks just live, think and plan for today only.

 

Don't fall for the line that people just cannot do it - for most people they have an entire lifetime to figure it out because it is a pretty normal result of life.  

 

U.S. Treasury 07/28/2017 - Treasury Announces Steps to Wind Down myRA Program

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Anyone who had a job with a large Corporation before 1985 was convinced they had no need for further retirement planning. They enjoyed "guarenteed benefit" pensions and while retirement health insurance was rare outside of Government service, Medicare and its various Plans were there for affordable care.

 

But SCOTUS has ruled emloyee pension funds are the property of the COMPANY not the employees, so companies began declaring bankruptcy and using the pension funds to give management bonuses, or simply informing the employees that their benefits would be different that what they'd been told for years and years.

 

The GOPers running the companies wept bitter tears, saying it was an undue burden to keep promises to workers, the facists of SCOTUS agreed, so workers got 401Ks or IRAs instead.

 

Here's the rub: The pensions of senior management did not go away, they got MUCH bigger.

 

The ability of the company to fund worker pensions was NEVER an actual problem, as little as joint contributions of 7% of worker pay into a 100% secure investment in 30-year Treasuries would give an average worker a nest egg of around $500,000 and 40 years of payments of $2000/month.

 

But that would leave less money for senior management, so it didn't happen.

 

About those wonderful 401Ks and IRAs - they're nothing but fodder for Wall Street. If you invested in a DJA index fund in 2000, your money would've earned an average of 3.873%, less than you'd have gotten investing in 30-year Treasuries. If you HAD to retire in 2008, you'd not even have gotten your actual investment back, let alone any appreciation. Every good GOPers swears allegance to Wall Street each morning when they rise, but fact is, it CRASHES and takes all the little guys down with it.

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@Olderscout66 wrote:

Anyone who had a job with a large Corporation before 1985 was convinced they had no need for further retirement planning. They enjoyed "guarenteed benefit" pensions and while retirement health insurance was rare outside of Government service, Medicare and its various Plans were there for affordable care.

 

But SCOTUS has ruled emloyee pension funds are the property of the COMPANY not the employees, so companies began declaring bankruptcy and using the pension funds to give management bonuses, or simply informing the employees that their benefits would be different that what they'd been told for years and years.

 

The GOPers running the companies wept bitter tears, saying it was an undue burden to keep promises to workers, the facists of SCOTUS agreed, so workers got 401Ks or IRAs instead.

 

Here's the rub: The pensions of senior management did not go away, they got MUCH bigger.

 

The ability of the company to fund worker pensions was NEVER an actual problem, as little as joint contributions of 7% of worker pay into a 100% secure investment in 30-year Treasuries would give an average worker a nest egg of around $500,000 and 40 years of payments of $2000/month.

 

But that would leave less money for senior management, so it didn't happen.

 

About those wonderful 401Ks and IRAs - they're nothing but fodder for Wall Street. If you invested in a DJA index fund in 2000, your money would've earned an average of 3.873%, less than you'd have gotten investing in 30-year Treasuries. If you HAD to retire in 2008, you'd not even have gotten your actual investment back, let alone any appreciation. Every good GOPers swears allegance to Wall Street each morning when they rise, but fact is, it CRASHES and takes all the little guys down with it.


SUNUVAGUN!!!!!  1985 again - wotta horrible year that must have been. Who were the "fascists" on that Court?

 

True - interest rates on savings have deteriorated. One major reason has been "quantitative easement". Was that a 1985 thing?

 

I had a retirement account in 1985 that did very well. I also bought bonds which did very well. I guess I didn't realize I was living through a fiscal disaster.

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All we need to do is be thankful and have compassion. Is that asking for too much ???

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@mandm84 wrote:

All we need to do is be thankful and have compassion. Is that asking for too much ???


"Compassion" is seeing a person in need and helping them.

 

Hypocrisy is passing regulations taking one person's property and giving it to someone else, and claiming compassion.

 

Is honesty asking too much?

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@rk9152 wrote:

 

So, does that make you a GOPerLord? It seems you want the government to take care of things for those people who are "too dumb and lazy" to attend to their needs.


You seem to be big on this 'reality' thing.  How about you try these on.

 

The 'dumb' ones 'can't' attend to their needs.  They don't know how and could't if they did....least of all their retirement needs.  Any job they do have will likely be casual.  When they have one, they are 'almost always' paid in 'cash OFF the books'.  'Almost always' it ain't enough to buy a tv dinner to cook in the microwave they don't have after they pay for a place to crash.  Hell, most of the time they don't have electricity to run much of anything where they go to sleep. That's reality.

 

Then there are the 'dumb' ones fortunate enough to have a steady job.  A retirement account funded out of their puny pay would really put the clamps on when it came to milk in the morning.  Without milk you get rickets if you're a kid and osteoporosis when you're older. Know what else?  The employer very likely doesn't kick a dime into the kitty for your retirement or anything else.  

 

Even IF these guys were smart enough to know they should 'provide for the future' they won't because they can't.  That's reality.  Eventually, they end up 'on the dole' or they die. They were born 'dumb'.  That's their reality.  There ain't no other. Now....when I see contempt for a handicap like limited mental capacity I have to consider the mental capacity of those who display it.  That too is reality.  

 

Then there are the ones who know what they should do but opt for something else...a savings account for retirement is low on their priority list. Every day somebody sticks some new gadget  or goodie in front of them they just have to have....NOW! 

 

The good capitalist marketing director got his market precisely right didn't he....better give him a bonus.  He knew today is today and tomorrow may never come. 

 

So....these are the ones who could do it, but they 'won't'  When they should have enough to provide for their own needs, they 'won't have it...and so they end up 'on the dole'.  What to do, what to do?  How about an enforced retirement program that will keep them off a 'tax-payer funded dole'. They would kick in their share, the employer kicks in a bit to cover some of the rest and that just might be enough to keep them 'off the dole'  At the least it would provide for a modicum of self respect.  You'd would be all in for that, I'd think.  Economically prudent too, don't you think.  That's the reality.    

 

'Can't' and 'won't'  end up in the same place in the world you posit. 'On the dole'.  Now that is dumb.  IF you think you have a reality based system that doesn't involve government in some way, let us all in on it.  I don't think you do....and that's the reality I see.

 

 

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 umbarch64 wrote

 

Can't' and 'won't' end up in the same place in the world you posit. 'On the dole'. Now that is dumb. IF you think you have a reality based system that doesn't involve government in some way, let us all in on it. I don't think you do....and that's the reality I see.

 

 ............................................................

 

Yep -

Here is another one of those "pie in the sky" programs designed by government that never got off the ground. The CLASS Act ( Community Living Assistance Services and Supports )

 

Designed by the late Senator Ted Kennedy and his staff and was included in the PPACA for implementation - nope, never got off the ground.

 

The problem is with us still - getting bigger by the day.

 

 Washington Post 09/21/2013 - Our Looming Long-Term Crisis

 

. . . . speaking in the past tense because there is no more CLASS Act. The Obama administration abandoned the idea because there was great concern that the voluntary nature wouldn’t make the program actuarially sound. There was fear that the people who needed the insurance the most would pay but that others who didn’t would opt out. Premiums in turn would be too high. If the insurance program became financially unstable, there would have been great pressure for the federal government to bail it out."

 

What's the answer?  

 

This money problem or lack thereof, with people is in my opinion the biggest problem we face with everything that it is connect to - now and into the future.

 

So trying to do something to help, on a voluntary basis, does not work.

But on the other hand, trying to dictate something doesn't work either.

 

What's the answer?  What will make people realize that they cannot just live for today because cost go up, other things become needed and it is up to them not to be dumb - they have to learn how to increase where they begin from into something where they can plan for their future - if not at 100% - at least something  - but not nothing.

 

So what is in the mind of some of these folks - they know they are gonna get older, they know that they could need health care, they know that they may need some sort of long term care, at least for a while -  They know they may not be able to work til they die.

Do they think about this when they are younger?

Do they just say to themselves, oh well, what will be, will be 

Do they just console any anguish which they might have with, the government (or my kids) will take care of me.  

I hope they have at least informed their kids - if that is their plan.

 

Maybemthey are gonna marry into wealth when they are old. Woman Wink

 

 

 

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"...Then you are in luck.  No need to complain.  The average retirement savings among those 56-61, close to retirement, is $163,000....".

I've written this a number of times. I'm a stats person, and one never gives an average number without a median number. Averages are crappola without a median.

"....  But that number doesn't tell the whole story. Since so many families have zero savings and since super-savers can pull up the average, the median savings, or those at the 50th percentile, may be a better gauge. The median for all working-age families in the U.S. is just $5,000...".
"...

Mean retirement savings of families between 44 and 49: $81,347
Median retirement savings of families between 44 and 49: $6,200

 

Mean retirement savings of families between 50 and 55: $124,831
Median retirement savings of families between 50 and 55: $8,000

 

Mean retirement savings of families between 56 and 61: $163,577
Median retirement savings of families between 56 and 61: $17,000".

 

This negates all the nonsense you guys have been spouting without understanding numbers. Changes all the arguments.

  Are there any other posters here who studied stats in college, or learned something about them elsewhere?


 


"...Why is everyone a victim? Take personal responsibility for your life..."
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@retiredtraveler wrote:
"...Then you are in luck.  No need to complain.  The average retirement savings among those 56-61, close to retirement, is $163,000....".

I've written this a number of times. I'm a stats person, and one never gives an average number without a median number. Averages are crappola without a median.

"....  But that number doesn't tell the whole story. Since so many families have zero savings and since super-savers can pull up the average, the median savings, or those at the 50th percentile, may be a better gauge. The median for all working-age families in the U.S. is just $5,000...".
"...

Mean retirement savings of families between 44 and 49: $81,347
Median retirement savings of families between 44 and 49: $6,200

 

Mean retirement savings of families between 50 and 55: $124,831
Median retirement savings of families between 50 and 55: $8,000

 

Mean retirement savings of families between 56 and 61: $163,577
Median retirement savings of families between 56 and 61: $17,000".

 

This negates all the nonsense you guys have been spouting without understanding numbers. Changes all the arguments.

  Are there any other posters here who studied stats in college, or learned something about them elsewhere?


 


Point noted.  

 

Just more reason for folks to denigrate those who don't have as much as they do. 

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NerdyMom wrote

 

Do you know a lot of seniors who as the government to bail them out? Most of the struggling seniors I know look to their kids for help. They move in with their kids when they can't make it on their own.

-----------------------------------------------------------

 

I guess if the adult kids can and want to take care of them - that is at least a plan -'hope the senior has talked this over with them in advance or at least before the situation unwinds completely.

 

However many times the senior still has to seek government help - maybe the adult kids too.

 

Whatever amount a person might save can only help them out when they can no longer work.

 

Are you saying that unless the amount is substantial, they are better off not saving because without it, they could receive government benefits faster?

 

That is not necessarily true because not all government programs look at assets; they only look at income.

 

 

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@GailL1 wrote:

NerdyMom wrote

 

Do you know a lot of seniors who as the government to bail them out? Most of the struggling seniors I know look to their kids for help. They move in with their kids when they can't make it on their own.

-----------------------------------------------------------

 

I guess if the adult kids can and want to take care of them - that is at least a plan -'hope the senior has talked this over with them in advance or at least before the situation unwinds completely.

 

However many times the senior still has to seek government help - maybe the adult kids too.

 

Whatever amount a person might save can only help them out when they can no longer work.

 

Are you saying that unless the amount is substantial, they are better off not saving because without it, they could receive government benefits faster?

 

That is not necessarily true because not all government programs look at assets; they only look at income.

 

 


No, that's ridiculous.   I don't get this mentality assuming everyone is gaming the system.   People work.   People save.  People lose their jobs.  They get sick.  They might get better.  They might not.  They make wise and unwise financial decisions.   They try again.  They are just trying to do the best they can.  Then, at any given time in their lives, they may be self-sufficient or they may need help.    

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$600 a month - all set for life..........

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NedyMom posted..
Part of the paycheck-to-paycheck problem is that housing and transportation costs are increasing percentages of a person's required monthly expenditures.

 

Quite right.  In high school, learning about budgeting in the real world, acceptable.workable housing budget was 1/4 of your net monthly income.  That worked for me into my mid-twenties and not since then.

Kid, you could interview homeless persons if you are at all interested in their "excuses".

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Oeanflower posted..

Kid, you could interview homeless persons if you are at all interested in their "excuses".

==================================================

I posted..

There will always be excuses for not saving for retirement and most of they do not hold water.

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

I do not think you understanded what I posted.


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I think I've seen a pitch for 'delayed gratification' and taking responsibility for your own future.  Not surprising folks our age see things that way.  It is the way they were raised.  So....how come the following generation[s] didn't pick up on that and run with it?  Hmmmmmmmmmm?  

 

Somehow  the following generation got the idea that 'they' didn't have to do this for some reason.  What would that be?  Who, oh who would do that to their kids?  Not conscientious parents certainly, no one would saddle their own children with that kind of a handicap....or would they? 

 

OH !  I know....the people who benefit a whole bunch from encouraging 'conspicuous consumption' and 'instant gratificatiomn' as a way of life.  So...let's follow the bouncing buck one more time. Know where you end up?   Right at the doorstep of the ones who said that we should borrow for now and pay off the debt from the 'growth' that was 'bound to happen'.....Oh,  and we wouldn't need taxes to do it. Can you say 'vested interest'?

 

You know who they are. "THEY" are the ones who cut taxes and drove up the National Debt so the very politicians responsible for the problem started to look for a cash cow to solve it.  That cash cow was Social Security and other social benefits. Sitting right there under their noses and way more than was needed, at least right now.  Tell the peons it's more important to have the cash to use to buy 'stuff' right now.  After all, the peons worked for it and they should be able to spend it however they want....right?  

 

Don't you get weary of this charade?  Programs like Social Security and Medicare are ways to help the little guy who, for a whole bunch of reasons...some valid, some not...can not OR will not do for himself.  That's reality, folks.  Not the 'grab your bootstraps and pull' BULL peddled to people who don't have boots.  You know who they are.

 

"Teach your Children Well".............there are a whole slug of other teachers out there that see your kids as a money tree to be harvested.  You know how kids are about listening to the old folks when somebody else has a better idea...and it makes YOU feel gooooooood!  Remember?  Hmmmmm?

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GailL1:

 

Think people will ever understand that someday they may not be working but living expenses keep coming in and keep getting higher.  Seems like most folks just live, think and plan for today only.

 

People who live paycheck to paycheck have their immediate survival to plan for, not the future.

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"....People who live paycheck to paycheck have their immediate survival to plan for, not the future....".
Yes. But the issue that will be argued, and for which it seems to be impossible to find facts, is why people live like that. Some stats show that a percentage of people in the 6-figure salary range, or just below, say they are living p-to-p.
  Whe know there is wage stagnation. Have people adjusted their spending habits to accomodate this fact (the 'latte arguments')? Did couples save before having children? One of the largest reasons for p-to-p living is credit card debt. What percentage of that debt is for circumstances beyond their control (medical costs not covered by insurance), or poor spending habits?  I've always been curioius about these questions being not only a long-time saver, but also investor. In my little corner of the world, I see people living beyond their means (who could definitely pare down their expenses). Is that the norm for country as a whole? I don't know.
  We do know that half the country cannot do the third-grade arithmetic to balance a checkbook. Also, those same people are unable to actually make a budget lacking the arithmetic abilities of a 9-year old. The majority of the county cannot define a stock or bond. 

 


"...Why is everyone a victim? Take personal responsibility for your life..."
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@Panjandrum wrote:

GailL1:

 

Think people will ever understand that someday they may not be working but living expenses keep coming in and keep getting higher.  Seems like most folks just live, think and plan for today only.

 

People who live paycheck to paycheck have their immediate survival to plan for, not the future.


This.   And sadly, there are more and more of them.  The middle class dwindles.  Their share of our nation's wealth is only about 20%.   It should be the majority.  

 

Yes, some with means are making unwise decisions.   But there is a significant number of people out there who have trouble paying their bills every month for their present, much less the ability to save for their future. 

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@NerdyMom wrote:



This.   And sadly, there are more and more of them.  The middle class dwindles.  Their share of our nation's wealth is only about 20%.   It should be the majority.  

 

Yes, some with means are making unwise decisions.   But there is a significant number of people out there who have trouble paying their bills every month for their present, much less the ability to save for their future. 


As NOT HAPPENING posted is because of the need for instant gratification and just having to have the latest fad.  I believe that most of us born before the Second World War know what it's like to do without.  Our parents didn't cater to our every want.   No doubt there are some who did so.  I believe today's trend started when there was an era of prosperity after the war.  The nation changed from a rural society to a metropolitian one and people began to have more time on their hands..

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@NerdyMom wrote:

@Panjandrum wrote:

GailL1:

 

Think people will ever understand that someday they may not be working but living expenses keep coming in and keep getting higher.  Seems like most folks just live, think and plan for today only.

 

People who live paycheck to paycheck have their immediate survival to plan for, not the future.


This.   And sadly, there are more and more of them.  The middle class dwindles.  Their share of our nation's wealth is only about 20%.   It should be the majority.  

 

Yes, some with means are making unwise decisions.   But there is a significant number of people out there who have trouble paying their bills every month for their present, much less the ability to save for their future. 


Part of the reason why the middle class is dwindling has to do with the "need" for the newest Iphone and the frequent stops at Starbucks for their expensive latte'.

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@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

@NerdyMom wrote:

@Panjandrum wrote:

GailL1:

 

Think people will ever understand that someday they may not be working but living expenses keep coming in and keep getting higher.  Seems like most folks just live, think and plan for today only.

 

People who live paycheck to paycheck have their immediate survival to plan for, not the future.


This.   And sadly, there are more and more of them.  The middle class dwindles.  Their share of our nation's wealth is only about 20%.   It should be the majority.  

 

Yes, some with means are making unwise decisions.   But there is a significant number of people out there who have trouble paying their bills every month for their present, much less the ability to save for their future. 


Part of the reason why the middle class is dwindling has to do with the "need" for the newest Iphone and the frequent stops at Starbucks for their expensive latte'.


I don't think these are as big of factors as housing and transportation.  The iphones might be an issue.   But many middle class folks I know have refurbished phones and prepaid contracts.   They don't use data.  They use wifi.  

 

 

 

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@GailL1 wrote:

Too bad - guess people have either found other ways to save for retirement or have decided NOT to save for retirement.


Never had an IRA, but of course I had guaranteed retirement income.  But never was able to save anything further.   Retired back in 2000 and since have managed to create a high five figure savings account.

 

And we've lived better since retiring (my wife has continued working and hopefully can be persuaded to retire after this year from the school system).  We have been paying cash instead of credit including buying new vehicles, although we get offers of low interest rates.

 

No doubt it depends upon an individual's circumstances such as we had our house paid off and remodeled before retirement.

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@TxGrandpa2 wrote:

@GailL1 wrote:

Too bad - guess people have either found other ways to save for retirement or have decided NOT to save for retirement.


Never had an IRA, but of course I had guaranteed retirement income.  But never was able to save anything further.   Retired back in 2000 and since have managed to create a high five figure savings account.

 

And we've lived better since retiring (my wife has continued working and hopefully can be persuaded to retire after this year from the school system).  We have been paying cash instead of credit including buying new vehicles, although we get offers of low interest rates.

 

No doubt it depends upon an individual's circumstances such as we had our house paid off and remodeled before retirement.


Buying smart is what you are doing and that is the simple formula for NOT depending on Government.  It's OK to buy with credit cards as long as you pay the FULL amount off when the bill arrives.  If you can't, tear up those cards. When the bank is paying you 0.1% interest and the credit card is charging 14-21% interest on unpaid balances, logic should tell you buying with credit cards and NOT paying the full amount is crazy.

 

I do like you, am retired awhile, doing quite fine, and following the formula stated above and you are too!

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@NOTHAPPENING wrote:



Buying smart is what you are doing and that is the simple formula for NOT depending on Government.  It's OK to buy with credit cards as long as you pay the FULL amount off when the bill arrives.  If you can't tear up those cards. When the bank is paying you 0.1% interest and the credit card is charging 14-21% interest on unpaid balances, logic should tell you buying with credit cards and NOT paying the full amount is crazy.

 

I do like you, am retired awhile, doing quite fine, and following the formula stated above and you are too!


I do carry a debit card that I use for all transactions, plus I use a personal finance program to track them.  At any time I'm aware of the status of both the checking and savings accounts.

 

Too many in retirement are doing the same as those still working...not having control of their finances as we are.

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@GailL1 wrote:

Too bad - guess people have either found other ways to save for retirement or have decided NOT to save for retirement.

 

Sure glad I didn't think along those lines.  Being self-employed for the majority of my working years, there was no employer match but some of the retirement tax vehicles really helped - 

 

Too bad people don't take advantage of the savers tax credit on their returns.

 

Think people will ever understand that someday they may not be working but living expenses keep coming in and keep getting higher.  Seems like most folks just live, think and plan for today only.

 

Don't fall for the line that people just cannot do it - for most people they have an entire lifetime to figure it out because it is a pretty normal result of life.  

 

U.S. Treasury 07/28/2017 - Treasury Announces Steps to Wind Down myRA Program


Gail 

 

1. Just wondering Gail - Do You Work on Your Own Vehicles - I Do and I save Thousands every year on both my Wifes and My 5 Kids Vehicles? 

 

2. Just Wondering Gail - Do You Do All Your Own Home Repairs - Plumbing - Electrical - Roofing - Remodeling & Repair? I Do and I save Thousands every year

 

3. Just wondering Gail - Do You Do All Your Own Yard Maintenance - Like Taking Down 75 Foot tll Pine Trees & removing the Stumps or how about Putting in a Pond or a Stone Wall or Patio - How About Grading all those high & low spots in the lawn or getting a Golf Course Quality Lawn? I Do and I save Thousands every year

 

All This Stuff is Really Very Easy................

 

Don't fall for the line that people just cannot do it - for most people they have an entire lifetime to figure it out because it is a pretty normal result of life.  

 

 

 

 

 

( " China if You're Listening - Get Trumps Tax Returns " )

" )
" - Anonymous

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@mickstuder wrote:

 

Gail 

1. Just wondering Gail - Do You Work on Your Own Vehicles - I Do and I save Thousands every year on both my Wifes and My 5 Kids Vehicles? 

2. Just Wondering Gail - Do You Do All Your Own Home Repairs - Plumbing - Electrical - Roofing - Remodeling & Repair? I Do and I save Thousands every year

3. Just wondering Gail - Do You Do All Your Own Yard Maintenance - Like Taking Down 75 Foot tll Pine Trees & removing the Stumps or how about Putting in a Pond or a Stone Wall or Patio - How About Grading all those high & low spots in the lawn or getting a Golf Course Quality Lawn? I Do and I save Thousands every year

All This Stuff is Really Very Easy................

 


I am not sure what those things have to do with the subject of saving for ones retirement but NO, mickstuder, I do not personally do any of those things.  I contribute to others to do those things for me - they hopefully are considering their retirement as part of the fees which they are charging me to do these jobs.

 

Funny you should ask, as we speak, I have tree guys in my yard with TONS of equipment removing and trimming as a big step in my landscape redesign - about (2) acres.  This will be part of my part to not only support the overall economy but individual workers and self employed individuals -'don't think I will ever have a golf course quality lawn - neither me nor the lawn guy that I have had for 17 years, have that goal.

 

If you think like the government, your savings from these task which you are talented enough to do, should be banked.  That was the premise for the expanded Medicaid program, states would save cost for the uninsured which they should bank to pay for their part of the expanded Medicaid program, but alas, government is just like many people, savings are never banked, any saved money is just spent elsewhere.

 

The absolute main problem which we have in this country and from whence many of our other problems emerge is that people either just don't make enough money to cover their basic responsibilities, don't know how to plan and budget for these responsibilities or they expect somebody else to do it for them.

 

i think most individuals have the ability to think and learn and can turn this around for themselves if they have the goal to do it.  

 

Perhaps people just accept a lower worth value by the work which they do because it requires no unique talents to do it.  That can be changed by them.

 

Planning and budgeting for the long range can be learned  and so can saving and investing, even if it is in an FDIC insured account or U.S. Treasuries - safe and secure.  

 

If they are expecting somebody else to do it for them, then they have to find that somebody else - 

 

Many just don't think ahead and one day they turn around, perhaps when they are late middle age and say where did the time go and boy, do I have a problem if I live a long life.  

 

Sure, I hear some of my friends say when they are 50 - 55 years old - "I will just work until I die". - Wonder if they will feel the same at 70?

Honored Social Butterfly


@GailL1 wrote:

@mickstuder wrote:

 

Gail 

1. Just wondering Gail - Do You Work on Your Own Vehicles - I Do and I save Thousands every year on both my Wifes and My 5 Kids Vehicles? 

2. Just Wondering Gail - Do You Do All Your Own Home Repairs - Plumbing - Electrical - Roofing - Remodeling & Repair? I Do and I save Thousands every year

3. Just wondering Gail - Do You Do All Your Own Yard Maintenance - Like Taking Down 75 Foot tll Pine Trees & removing the Stumps or how about Putting in a Pond or a Stone Wall or Patio - How About Grading all those high & low spots in the lawn or getting a Golf Course Quality Lawn? I Do and I save Thousands every year

All This Stuff is Really Very Easy................

 


I am not sure what those things have to do with the subject of saving for ones retirement but NO, mickstuder, I do not personally do any of those things.  I contribute to others to do those things for me - they hopefully are considering their retirement as part of the fees which they are charging me to do these jobs.

 

Funny you should ask, as we speak, I have tree guys in my yard with TONS of equipment removing and trimming as a big step in my landscape redesign - about (2) acres.  This will be part of my part to not only support the overall economy but individual workers and self employed individuals -'don't think I will ever have a golf course quality lawn - neither me nor the lawn guy that I have had for 17 years, have that goal.

 

If you think like the government, your savings from these task which you are talented enough to do, should be banked.  That was the premise for the expanded Medicaid program, states would save cost for the uninsured which they should bank to pay for their part of the expanded Medicaid program, but alas, government is just like many people, savings are never banked, any saved money is just spent elsewhere.

 

The absolute main problem which we have in this country and from whence many of our other problems emerge is that people either just don't make enough money to cover their basic responsibilities, don't know how to plan and budget for these responsibilities or they expect somebody else to do it for them.

 

i think most individuals have the ability to think and learn and can turn this around for themselves if they have the goal to do it.  

 

Perhaps people just accept a lower worth value by the work which they do because it requires no unique talents to do it.  That can be changed by them.

 

Planning and budgeting for the long range can be learned  and so can saving and investing, even if it is in an FDIC insured account or U.S. Treasuries - safe and secure.  

 

If they are expecting somebody else to do it for them, then they have to find that somebody else - 

 

Many just don't think ahead and one day they turn around, perhaps when they are late middle age and say where did the time go and boy, do I have a problem if I live a long life.  

 

Sure, I hear some of my friends say when they are 50 - 55 years old - "I will just work until I die". - Wonder if they will feel the same at 70?


Well of course you don;t..............................................Why - because you have no problem taking advantage of Government Gimmicks in the Tax Code to get ahead.......................You have no Problem having a working Professional Knowledge of the Insurance Industry and wondering why the rest of us have so much trouble just keeping up with the Routine Everyday Requirements of trying to get Quality Healthcare at Affordable Costs...........................simple things that take hours and hours to resolve on the phone online and in person - things like - oh well you didn;t get a referral - you didn;t pay your co-pay - you haven;t met your deductable......................today I got a Letter from BC/BS telling me that my Omeprazole 20 Mg Rx is going to be re-scheduled to Tier 3 - and cost me double what I pay now - Really - I never knew it had been repurposed from Teir 1 or Two - in fact what are Tiers in the First place............................I fell on the Ice & Broke my shoulder in 3 places back in December - someone called the Police & a Ambulance because I couldn;t get up off my Snow Covered Front Lawn by Myself..................I had to sing Paperwork refusing treatment & transport because while I am forced to be on Medicare Part A because I have reached Full Retirement Age - the Part B Program is so confusing and costly I chose to stay on my Wifes Employer provided health-insurance at no Cost - however that means I have no Emergency Room Coverage - No Coverage for Ambulance Transport and I have to be admitted to the Hospital for 3 days to get Hospital Coverage and thats only if I make sure I'm not classifed as a Inpatient for Observation Only 

 

So What Does All This Have to do with you and your post - - your last sentence - 

 

Don't fall for the line that people just cannot do it - for most people they have an entire lifetime to figure it out because it is a pretty normal result of life.

 

 

Well all the stuff I described above that I can do - took me a Lifetime to figure out - it wasn;t given to me through some Government Tax Code Scheme - and it wasn;t given to me through some Ponzi Stock Market Scheme where people also do nothing and get value...................no I learned it the Old-Fashioned Way - Trial & Error - Practice and Experience - anyone can do what I did - but very few can do what you did & do - because it's not a Normal Result of Life...............................most people at least those in my Gray Matter & Income Scale are too busy - having to repair their own vehicles - having to take down their own trees and build their own fences to spend the amount of time required just to try and understand why my 20 Mg of Omeprazole Prescription - Omeprazole that has been around for 35 years is going to cost me so much more and the best part is - the Generic Over the Counter Omeprazole that I've tried to substitute a dozen or more times everytime my Rx Omeprazole gets a Price Escalation - Does Not Work the Same as the Rx - even at the same or higher Mg  

 

My stuff simply takes physical effort & a little common sense & interest - your stuff takes background knowledge if not insider information not available to the rest of us.....................even if we had the time..................................

 

As far as your simplistic recommendation for Personal Finances - again - working Middle Class people do not have the time - to do either the learning or even if they could learn no time to do the investing - again we are so bogged down by the Institutional Mazes and Constant Changes - it's imposssible 

 

My next door neighbor just bought her house - like a good hard working & responsible person - she paid attention at her closing and was told what her Monthly Mortgage Payment was going to be - so when she received the first bill - it said the Due Date - trying to do the Right Thing - the Due Date was August First so she mailed her first payment 15 days early - 6 days later she got a letter from har Mortgage Company informing her - they sold her mortgage to XYZ company - but wait her payment to the first company was already in the mail - well of course the first company no longer had her account so when the payment arrived - no one knew what to do so they just deposited it - then she got a letter from the new Mortgage Company telling her - her first payment was overdue and there would be late fees and she needed to get the payment overnighted - the first mortgage company told her it would take several weeks to do a audit to see if they actually recieved her payment and then if they could find it - another several weeks to cut a reimbursement check - so she had to pay her first mortgage payment twice - once to Company A & again to Company B until she hopefully gets her money returned from company A - the next week she gets an other letter frm Company B advising her that her Home Insurance had expired and they would be charging her for home insurance at a higher cost until she forwarded them a binder from her Original Home Insurance Company - guess what - her Home Insurance did not expire or lapse - the problem - Company A never forwarded the Binder - Company B didn;t want to spend the time looking up who her Insurance Company was and asking either them or Company A for a copy so they just freaked out their new client and to save money made her do the legwork - this could happen to her monthly 

 

Bottomline - the system is rigged and stacked against the Middle Class - my rant here is about just some of the True Real Life Experiences people have to endure and the amount of time effort & frustration people have to go through 

 

So I'm not buying - that it's so easy anyone can do it - it's not and I found your comments insulting and insensitive.........................and out of touch with the lives of normal Middle Class people

 

BTW I noticed the Ponzi Market hit another Record High today - 22,000 or something - that means exactly NOTHING to me and my neighbor and the more than 50% of other Americans who have nothing invested in any form in the Ponzi Market

 

So again - it's no where as simple as you claim

 

 

 

 

 

 

( " China if You're Listening - Get Trumps Tax Returns " )

" )
" - Anonymous

Honored Social Butterfly

BTW - All that stuff I do myself - not part of some Glorious Retirement Savings Initiative - it's done by necessity............................why so my wife and I could pay half of our 5 kids College Expenses so instead of getting Raped by the Colleges & College Loan Sharks at 6% on !00k each they are only getting screwed on 50k at 6% - all BTW while the Prime is at 0.5%...................so again we all have different Priorities...............................mine isn't about me and how many Trips to Greece I can take as a Retiree................it's understanding how hard it was for me to just keep my head above water and hoping my 5 kids could be in Gails World someday with the only difference being the people who made it possible were Family not Politicians and Bankers and Insurance Companies who prey on the Middle Class 

 

 

 

 

( " China if You're Listening - Get Trumps Tax Returns " )

" )
" - Anonymous

Honored Social Butterfly


@mickstuder wrote:

BTW - All that stuff I do myself - not part of some Glorious Retirement Savings Initiative - it's done by necessity............................why so my wife and I could pay half of our 5 kids College Expenses so instead of getting Raped by the Colleges & College Loan Sharks at 6% on !00k each they are only getting screwed on 50k at 6% - all BTW while the Prime is at 0.5%...................so again we all have different Priorities...............................mine isn't about me and how many Trips to Greece I can take as a Retiree................it's understanding how hard it was for me to just keep my head above water and hoping my 5 kids could be in Gails World someday with the only difference being the people who made it possible were Family not Politicians and Bankers and Insurance Companies who prey on the Middle Class 

 

 

 

 


This is a HUGE priority for me, too.  I could pay my way through college, because college was cheaper.   It's no longer cheap.   One of the greatest gifts we can give our children is education that is unsaddled or minimally saddled with debt.  

 

I have an attorney friend who graduated with $240,000 school loan debt.   $240,000.   At the time, that was the cost of a house around here.  She is the first person out of poverty in her family.  But there was nobody around who knew enough to tell her, at 18, that choosing a cheaper college and law school would likely be in her better interest.   

 

She is saving for retirement but she cannot afford to save for her own kids' education.   And that is where her family line will see a lost opportunity for the transfer of wealth.    

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Honored Social Butterfly


@GailL1 wrote:

 

Sure, I hear some of my friends say when they are 50 - 55 years old - "I will just work until I die". - Wonder if they will feel the same at 70?


A comment on that.  My wife is in her mid 70s, and every year keeps saying 'maybe I'll retire this year'.  We don't need the income, but she enjoys working, especially since it's around young children.  She says she would miss that.

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Honored Social Butterfly

Look there will always been people that simply don't care, and now we are seeing lots of them.

This new generation is very different than my generation or even my kids generations.

They don't put the same value that we did to getting older, they either don't think that anything will happen to them or that they don't care if they ever get old.

There is a destruction of certain values in this generation that is creating all sorts of problems for this country.

We are now seeing probably the beginning of the decline of the US  and apparently many don't think is important enough.
Perhaps a good old fashion war a real war not the kind of wars that we have been involved in the last 20 years, will wake up this public that seemms to think that we are now a normal country.

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