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Re: The GOP Tax Cut Scam

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Message 181 of 209

@Centristsin2010 wrote:

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

@sp362 wrote:

NOTHAPPENING,  Our national debt is over 100% of GDP.  Why are we not paying it down BEFORE a tax cut is given?  Cutting taxes has NEVER increased tax revenue, even if it had, taxes are already low enough to start involving the law of diminishing returns into the calculations.  So, in 8 years, who is really going to end up paying for these cuts?


Why didn't you ask Obama that question when he took office when the debt was $10 trillion dollars and after ONLY eight years he managed to get the debt up 100% to $20 trillion dollars while raising a variety of taxes?

 

Why does the left believe that doing the same thing (failure) will result in a different outcome?


LOL....NH.  What a fraud.  You claimed you knew more than others about debt and deficit and now you want to con people with your mis-leading comments.  Of course the numbers you provide include paying off the TWO unfunded Bush wars and the interest of the Bush debt,

 

Obama only increased the debt $7.9 trillion and that included the stimulus package, extending unemployment benefits which was needed because of the Bush economy. He also CUT TAXES $858 billion which is included in the debt. Hypocrites are frauds and often lie.


More phony information. Fact - when Obama entered office, the debt was $10 trillion.  When he left office it was just shy of $20 trillion. That is the fact. You can try to attribute it to some of your left wing drivel, but the ownership of the debt belongs to the President in office at the time!

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The GOP Tax Cut Scam

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Message 182 of 209

 

NH still doesn't get it. Obamacare designed $700 Million in SAVINGS for Medicare, not cuts. Seniors didn't lose a single benefit while capturing a few minor enhancments to health care. 

 

Did Obamacare save that level of money the past seven years? I don't know, but it certainly wasn't a cut. NH, Romney, and others on the right portrayed it as a cut when in fact it wasn't. The Affordable Care Act cut future Medicare costs by reducing payments to private insurers and hospitals, not beneficiaries.

 

Those on the right simply didn't understand the mechanics of the bill.

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Re: The GOP Tax Cut Scam

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Message 183 of 209

@sp362 wrote:

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

@sp362 wrote:

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

@sp362 wrote:

NOTHAPPENING,  Our national debt is over 100% of GDP.  Why are we not paying it down BEFORE a tax cut is given?  Cutting taxes has NEVER increased tax revenue, even if it had, taxes are already low enough to start involving the law of diminishing returns into the calculations.  So, in 8 years, who is really going to end up paying for these cuts?


Why didn't you ask Obama that question when he took office when the debt was $10 trillion dollars and after ONLY eight years he managed to get the debt up 100% to $20 trillion dollars while raising a variety of taxes?


That goes back to basic economics.  You have three major groups spending money, consumers, businesses and the government.  When the country went into a recession and businesses and consumers severely curtailed their spending, if the government also decreased spending, it would have driven us into a full scale depression.  The government needed to spend to prop up the economy. 

So it is something of a paradox, when times are bad, the government needs to spend money.  That means when times are good, government spending can slow and what was spent when times were bad should be repaid.  This has nothing to do with which party is in power at the time.

If you think you are still going to be alive in eight years, you should be concerned about the bill that will be coming due.


Trump is looking at it this way: lowering corporate taxes from 35% to 21% will make America look more attractive possibly bringing back some wealth that is sitting on the other side of the pond. It may not be enough since Ireland has a 12.5% corporate tax. If some of that money comes back creating jobs here, that will fund the treasury as well as the personal income taxes collected from the new jobs.

 

Lowering the personal income taxes puts more money in our pockets which should provide the funds to buy things which in turn provide taxes to the treasury.

 

Bottom line is Trump is betting that cutting taxes will ultimately lower the debt while creating a deficit for a short time.  Is he right?  I think so but doing the same thing over (that doesn't work) is just stupid.


The arguments you put forth is what people use to try to justify Supply Side economics that has been done in the past and NEVER worked. Since it has NEVER worked in the past, would you call this attempt "stupid"?  How is using the extra revenue that would be created without a tax cut to pay the debt "stupid"?


We NEVER lowered the corporate tax to 21% while lowering the personal income taxes so don't make believe that we tried this before. Since Trump is here EMPLOYMENT is much higher than any of Obama's years in office.

 

Your claim that not cutting taxes could be used to cut the "debt" is foolish since Obama tried that (even increasing taxes) and saw the debt double.  I'll repeat - doing the same thing (that doesn't work) is stupid!

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Re: The GOP Tax Cut Scam

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Message 184 of 209

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

@sp362 wrote:

NOTHAPPENING,  Our national debt is over 100% of GDP.  Why are we not paying it down BEFORE a tax cut is given?  Cutting taxes has NEVER increased tax revenue, even if it had, taxes are already low enough to start involving the law of diminishing returns into the calculations.  So, in 8 years, who is really going to end up paying for these cuts?


Why didn't you ask Obama that question when he took office when the debt was $10 trillion dollars and after ONLY eight years he managed to get the debt up 100% to $20 trillion dollars while raising a variety of taxes?

 

Why does the left believe that doing the same thing (failure) will result in a different outcome?


LOL....NH.  What a fraud.  You claimed you knew more than others about debt and deficit and now you want to con people with your mis-leading comments.  Of course the numbers you provide include paying off the TWO unfunded Bush wars and the interest of the Bush debt,

 

Obama only increased the debt $7.9 trillion and that included the stimulus package, extending unemployment benefits which was needed because of the Bush economy. He also CUT TAXES $858 billion which is included in the debt. Hypocrites are frauds and often lie.


"FAKE 45 #illegitimate" read a sign at the Woman's March in Washington DC, January 21, 2017.
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Re: The GOP Tax Cut Scam

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Message 185 of 209

 

Did I hear right today?

The repeal of the ACA mandates is still part of the Tax Reform Bill? I'm shocked. I'll bet the insurance lobby is working around the clock to save the mandates.

But, here's my wild guess: The Republicans will remove it from the Tax Reform Bill when some Democrats agree to support the Bill IF Republicans don't touch the ACA mandates. The Republicans agree, then claim they now have "bi-partisan support" for their Tax Reform Bill.

The vote is coming up soon. They have only days to remove that portion of the Tax Reform Bill.

If the mandates are removed, it would be like repealing ObamaCare. It would eventually collapse. We'll see what happens, soon enough.

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Re: The GOP Tax Cut Scam

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Message 186 of 209

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

@sp362 wrote:

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

@sp362 wrote:

NOTHAPPENING,  Our national debt is over 100% of GDP.  Why are we not paying it down BEFORE a tax cut is given?  Cutting taxes has NEVER increased tax revenue, even if it had, taxes are already low enough to start involving the law of diminishing returns into the calculations.  So, in 8 years, who is really going to end up paying for these cuts?


Why didn't you ask Obama that question when he took office when the debt was $10 trillion dollars and after ONLY eight years he managed to get the debt up 100% to $20 trillion dollars while raising a variety of taxes?


That goes back to basic economics.  You have three major groups spending money, consumers, businesses and the government.  When the country went into a recession and businesses and consumers severely curtailed their spending, if the government also decreased spending, it would have driven us into a full scale depression.  The government needed to spend to prop up the economy. 

So it is something of a paradox, when times are bad, the government needs to spend money.  That means when times are good, government spending can slow and what was spent when times were bad should be repaid.  This has nothing to do with which party is in power at the time.

If you think you are still going to be alive in eight years, you should be concerned about the bill that will be coming due.


Trump is looking at it this way: lowering corporate taxes from 35% to 21% will make America look more attractive possibly bringing back some wealth that is sitting on the other side of the pond. It may not be enough since Ireland has a 12.5% corporate tax. If some of that money comes back creating jobs here, that will fund the treasury as well as the personal income taxes collected from the new jobs.

 

Lowering the personal income taxes puts more money in our pockets which should provide the funds to buy things which in turn provide taxes to the treasury.

 

Bottom line is Trump is betting that cutting taxes will ultimately lower the debt while creating a deficit for a short time.  Is he right?  I think so but doing the same thing over (that doesn't work) is just stupid.


The arguments you put forth is what people use to try to justify Supply Side economics that has been done in the past and NEVER worked. Since it has NEVER worked in the past, would you call this attempt "stupid"?  How is using the extra revenue that would be created without a tax cut to pay the debt "stupid"?

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Re: The GOP Tax Cut Scam

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Message 187 of 209

@sp362 wrote:

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

@sp362 wrote:

NOTHAPPENING,  Our national debt is over 100% of GDP.  Why are we not paying it down BEFORE a tax cut is given?  Cutting taxes has NEVER increased tax revenue, even if it had, taxes are already low enough to start involving the law of diminishing returns into the calculations.  So, in 8 years, who is really going to end up paying for these cuts?


Why didn't you ask Obama that question when he took office when the debt was $10 trillion dollars and after ONLY eight years he managed to get the debt up 100% to $20 trillion dollars while raising a variety of taxes?


That goes back to basic economics.  You have three major groups spending money, consumers, businesses and the government.  When the country went into a recession and businesses and consumers severely curtailed their spending, if the government also decreased spending, it would have driven us into a full scale depression.  The government needed to spend to prop up the economy. 

So it is something of a paradox, when times are bad, the government needs to spend money.  That means when times are good, government spending can slow and what was spent when times were bad should be repaid.  This has nothing to do with which party is in power at the time.

If you think you are still going to be alive in eight years, you should be concerned about the bill that will be coming due.


Trump is looking at it this way: lowering corporate taxes from 35% to 21% will make America look more attractive possibly bringing back some wealth that is sitting on the other side of the pond. It may not be enough since Ireland has a 12.5% corporate tax. If some of that money comes back creating jobs here, that will fund the treasury as well as the personal income taxes collected from the new jobs.

 

Lowering the personal income taxes puts more money in our pockets which should provide the funds to buy things which in turn provide taxes to the treasury.

 

Bottom line is Trump is betting that cutting taxes will ultimately lower the debt while creating a deficit for a short time.  Is he right?  I think so but doing the same thing over (that doesn't work) is just stupid.

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Re: The GOP Tax Cut Scam

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Message 188 of 209

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

@sp362 wrote:

NOTHAPPENING,  Our national debt is over 100% of GDP.  Why are we not paying it down BEFORE a tax cut is given?  Cutting taxes has NEVER increased tax revenue, even if it had, taxes are already low enough to start involving the law of diminishing returns into the calculations.  So, in 8 years, who is really going to end up paying for these cuts?


Why didn't you ask Obama that question when he took office when the debt was $10 trillion dollars and after ONLY eight years he managed to get the debt up 100% to $20 trillion dollars while raising a variety of taxes?


That goes back to basic economics.  You have three major groups spending money, consumers, businesses and the government.  When the country went into a recession and businesses and consumers severely curtailed their spending, if the government also decreased spending, it would have driven us into a full scale depression.  The government needed to spend to prop up the economy. 

So it is something of a paradox, when times are bad, the government needs to spend money.  That means when times are good, government spending can slow and what was spent when times were bad should be repaid.  This has nothing to do with which party is in power at the time.

If you think you are still going to be alive in eight years, you should be concerned about the bill that will be coming due.

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Valued Social Butterfly
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Re: The GOP Tax Cut Scam

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Message 189 of 209

@sp362 wrote:

NOTHAPPENING,  Our national debt is over 100% of GDP.  Why are we not paying it down BEFORE a tax cut is given?  Cutting taxes has NEVER increased tax revenue, even if it had, taxes are already low enough to start involving the law of diminishing returns into the calculations.  So, in 8 years, who is really going to end up paying for these cuts?


Why didn't you ask Obama that question when he took office when the debt was $10 trillion dollars and after ONLY eight years he managed to get the debt up 100% to $20 trillion dollars while raising a variety of taxes?

 

Why does the left believe that doing the same thing (failure) will result in a different outcome?

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Re: The GOP Tax Cut Scam

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Message 190 of 209

@CriticalThinking wrote:

NH said, "Please provide a link to document "your claim" that the Trump tax plan cuts $400 billion from Medicare funds."

 

It's a fair question, but how come NH never provided a link to prove his bogus claim that Obamacare cut $700 Billion from Medicare?  Why is he suddenly so adamant about proof?


....Contrary to their expectations, however, it has been the Obama campaign that has been forced to defend its $716 billion in cuts to the Medicare program, cuts that Mitt Romney promises to repeal. In the weeks ahead, those defenses won’t hold up. Here’s why.

 

... By contrast, Obamacare cut $716 billion from Medicare in order to fund $1.9 trillion in new health care spending, through the law’s expansion of Medicaid and its new subsidized exchanges.

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2012/08/16/fact-checking-the-obama-campaigns-defense-of-i...

 

As to how the Affordable Care Act actually gets to $716 billion in Medicare savings, that's a bit more complicated. John McDonough did the best job explaining it in his 2011 book, "Inside National Health Reform." There, he looked at all the various Medicare cuts Democrats made to pay for the Affordable Care Act.

The majority of the cuts, as you can see in this chart below, come from reductions in how much Medicare reimburses hospitals and private health insurance companies.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2012/08/14/romneys-right-obamacare-cuts-medicare-by-716-...

 

 

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