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Re: SOCIALISM EQUALS COMMUNISM ?

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Message 71 of 95

@rk9152 wrote:

@Snoopy48 wrote:

There are many examples of the success of socialism in multiple countries including the United States. 

 

A couple big examples of socialism working in the US is Social Security and to a certain extent insurance. Farmers for many decades established grain co-ops which is another example of socialism in this country. The power grid was first built out through the Rural Electric Cooperative another socialistic endeavor.

 

Communism as envisioned has never been tried in a modern country, What has been called 'Communism' over the last 75 years is simply another dictatorship. Supposed examples of Communist countries - Soviet Union, China, Cuba, etc - were just controlled by a limited ruling faction where the people neither owned nor had any say in anything.

 

There have been ancient examples of Communism (as envisioned) that existed for centuries until defeated by outsiders.


Co-ops are freely entered into and independent of government control (except the same industry regulations which apply to others). There is a difference between that an national Socialism.

 

As to your examples including Cuba - we have posters who consider Socialism as ownership of everything by "we the people" and the government as mere agent working for the people. Cuba etal are great examples of the naivete of that.


Yes, like capitalism, there are all kinds of definitions for socialism.  You really have to ask what the person means. Of course, conservatives pick the most restrictive and least effective image they can find for their vision of socialism while the rest of the world makes it work quite well. 

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Message 72 of 95

@Snoopy48 wrote:

There are many examples of the success of socialism in multiple countries including the United States. 

 

A couple big examples of socialism working in the US is Social Security and to a certain extent insurance. Farmers for many decades established grain co-ops which is another example of socialism in this country. The power grid was first built out through the Rural Electric Cooperative another socialistic endeavor.

 

Communism as envisioned has never been tried in a modern country, What has been called 'Communism' over the last 75 years is simply another dictatorship. Supposed examples of Communist countries - Soviet Union, China, Cuba, etc - were just controlled by a limited ruling faction where the people neither owned nor had any say in anything.

 

There have been ancient examples of Communism (as envisioned) that existed for centuries until defeated by outsiders.


Co-ops are freely entered into and independent of government control (except the same industry regulations which apply to others). There is a difference between that an national Socialism.

 

As to your examples including Cuba - we have posters who consider Socialism as ownership of everything by "we the people" and the government as mere agent working for the people. Cuba etal are great examples of the naivete of that.

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Re: SOCIALISM EQUALS COMMUNISM ?

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Message 73 of 95

@Roxanna35 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

 

It is an economic and social system established and controlled by the required, all powerful political system.

 



 No matter how many times one reads your "defomation" containing "aht" "we" had explained - "we" are wrong.

 


You are correct  you have just described Communism


And Marx saw Socialism as the method of getting there.

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Message 74 of 95

Hoping that the differences are quite clear. 

 

Sorta 

 

The military, the common defense is socialism, in theory we all pay for and own the military, but it's not like we can go drive a tank around

 

We all pay for and own public schools, but we can't go live in them.

 

We all pay for and own public roads, parks, libraries , we all own public lands, waterways, seas.

 

The list goes on and on, courts,  prisons, hospitals, oil reserves, gold reserves, timber.

 

We can only use those commons as the law allows.

 

However much of the US  is owned by we the people

 

When people equate socialism with whatever and scorn it they overlook the assets and property owned by we the people, the jobs, the incomes, the retirement and pensions provided, how that public money moves into the private sector, defense contractors, general contractors, medical providers and so on.

 

There already is plenty of socialism in the US, I think the question is who does that socialism benefit, who should it benefit, how is that wealth distributed, what the tax burden is and for who.

 

 

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Message 75 of 95

Yeah , but the top .5% live a dream in our Plutocratic system courtesy the Far Right , many of which are bamboozled into the poor house , while the top .5% laugh all the way to the bank !!!

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Message 76 of 95

What our resident RWNJs would call socialism works like this. Society decides that something is in the public interest. health care, funding retirement plans, schools, competent daycare, subways, the military.  Then, they put together a plan to provide these services and a plan to fund those services. Everybody who is capable kicks in. Those who have more resources can buy better services.  

 

Works in every other nation and saves them a ton of money.  

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Re: SOCIALISM EQUALS COMMUNISM ?

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Message 77 of 95

@KidBoy2 wrote:
Rker posted..

Kidboy, socialism is not a political system. Is not a Democracy or a Dictatorship is an economic system
and I thought aht we had explained the whole thing well. Kidboy, the US has some companies that are in effect Socialists, it only means that it is owned not by Corporations, or the Goverment it is own by a cooperative
or the employees themselves.. Please read agaim the defimotion.You all see now as to why the word socialism and communism are in the mind of Americans synonims.

=========================

I posted..

Sounds like Utopia.

I do not think even Bernie Sanders would want that Socialism. It does not work the way your definition described it.

Your answer to my post does not make sense.



The most socialistic institution in America is the United States military.  Millions of Americans getting together, making the same sacrifices, and working for a common goal. 

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Re: SOCIALISM EQUALS COMMUNISM ?

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Message 78 of 95

@Roxanna35 wrote:

So  according to you socialism and Communism are one and the same?  please explain. Because there are Democracies with Socialist  economies. and they are not government owed  please explain. as to why you make socialism= to communism


21,

I wrote a whole paragrah that explained the differance. Do you have a reading problem?

 

What method or methods a country uses to fill its government jobs has nothing to do with its government's form. Venezuela has a Socialist government. We have a Republic government. We both use Democracy and appointment to fill our top level government jobs.

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Re: SOCIALISM EQUALS COMMUNISM ?

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Message 79 of 95
Rker posted..

Kidboy, socialism is not a political system. Is not a Democracy or a Dictatorship is an economic system
and I thought aht we had explained the whole thing well. Kidboy, the US has some companies that are in effect Socialists, it only means that it is owned not by Corporations, or the Goverment it is own by a cooperative
or the employees themselves.. Please read agaim the defimotion.You all see now as to why the word socialism and communism are in the mind of Americans synonims.

=========================

I posted..

Sounds like Utopia.

I do not think even Bernie Sanders would want that Socialism. It does not work the way your definition described it.

Your answer to my post does not make sense.


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Message 80 of 95

@Roxanna35 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

 

It is an economic and social system established and controlled by the required, all powerful political system.

 



 No matter how many times one reads your "defomation" containing "aht" "we" had explained - "we" are wrong.

 


You are correct  you have just described Communism


The right does not understand what socialism is or how it works. It is why every other developed country in the world has a common plan for retirement and health care while we have the most expensive, least effective  and fewest citizens covered. 

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