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Re: OMG The Socialists R Exploding Heads at CPAC

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@rk9152 wrote:

 

 


Another post based purely on spreading the other guy's money around. And the "bait" - free stuff.

I can understand the concern. Since America's aristocracy controls 90% of the wealth, any increase in spending would have to fall on their shoulders.  If you look at it that way, you can see why they keep shouting "socialism" every time we try to emulate the success of the Nordic countries. 

 

The Nordic countries  pay for health care, retirement, child care, out of a common pool of funds much like we do for our public schools.  They are healthier , happier, and more prosperous. All we are asking is to implement the programs used by the winners.

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Re: OMG The Socialists R Exploding Heads at CPAC

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@Olderscout66 wrote:

The whole thing was explained to me years ago by a German friend:

"In Germany, EVERYTHING is socialist -EXCEPT THE GOVERNMENT!

If we let the Socialists run the Government, they will screw everything up, so we elect moderates who we make provide health care, education, transportation, retirement, worker protection, paid vacations and sick and family leave and prevent accumulation of great wealth with a rational tax structure and corporate laws and regulations. Out taxes may be higher than the US, but so what? We still have more truly disposable income because all the things you have to pay for are already paid for by the taxes, and because we did it together, it all costs much less than if we each had to get it for ourselves."

 

We need to give that a try.We were well on our way until 1965 when they got rid of the 91% TMR which nobody really paid (average effective tax rate for the wealthiest Americans was 38%) but DID insure profits got shared with the workers who produced them.

 

Step one remove the obsticle to such a logical solution - the neoRepublicans who insist we redistribute all the income to the top and eventually, the top will tire of so much wealth, and bestow a Golden Shower on the 99%

 

 


Another post based purely on spreading the other guy's money around. And the "bait" - free stuff.
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Re: OMG The Socialists R Exploding Heads at CPAC

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@Richva wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@Richva wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@Richva wrote:

I can only say that the current system is not working for the American people and it is refreshing to see the new batch of lawmakers examining possible solutions. 
Except for pay based on need - what solutions have you been refreshed by hearing about??

 


After two years of almost nonstop inability to govern, it is just nice to be see Congress actually addressing Americas issues rather than covering up affairs with porn stars.

 

Who proposed pay based on need?  Was that part of Trump's proposal to bail out the farmers he is killing with his trade war?


Those weeping and gnashing their teeth over the plight of the single mother qualified only for an entry level position. 

 

"Porn stars"??????


Yes.The Republican led government has spent its two years doing nothing better than protecting Trump from his dalliances with porn stars and selling out his hotel to the Saudis. 

 

I am not sure of your reference to the plight of the single mother. Are you suggesting an entry level position should not pay a living wage?


As I think you understand, I am pointing out the thinking of some that one should be paid based on need not the job itself. 

 

Do you have any thoughts on that?

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Re: OMG The Socialists R Exploding Heads at CPAC

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Message 4 of 36

The whole thing was explained to me years ago by a German friend:

"In Germany, EVERYTHING is socialist -EXCEPT THE GOVERNMENT!

If we let the Socialists run the Government, they will screw everything up, so we elect moderates who we make provide health care, education, transportation, retirement, worker protection, paid vacations and sick and family leave and prevent accumulation of great wealth with a rational tax structure and corporate laws and regulations. Out taxes may be higher than the US, but so what? We still have more truly disposable income because all the things you have to pay for are already paid for by the taxes, and because we did it together, it all costs much less than if we each had to get it for ourselves."

 

We need to give that a try.We were well on our way until 1965 when they got rid of the 91% TMR which nobody really paid (average effective tax rate for the wealthiest Americans was 38%) but DID insure profits got shared with the workers who produced them.

 

Step one remove the obsticle to such a logical solution - the neoRepublicans who insist we redistribute all the income to the top and eventually, the top will tire of so much wealth, and bestow a Golden Shower on the 99%

 

 

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Re: OMG The Socialists R Exploding Heads at CPAC

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Message 5 of 36

@rk9152 wrote:

@Richva wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@Richva wrote:

I can only say that the current system is not working for the American people and it is refreshing to see the new batch of lawmakers examining possible solutions. 
Except for pay based on need - what solutions have you been refreshed by hearing about??

 


After two years of almost nonstop inability to govern, it is just nice to be see Congress actually addressing Americas issues rather than covering up affairs with porn stars.

 

Who proposed pay based on need?  Was that part of Trump's proposal to bail out the farmers he is killing with his trade war?


Those weeping and gnashing their teeth over the plight of the single mother qualified only for an entry level position. 

 

"Porn stars"??????


Yes.The Republican led government has spent its two years doing nothing better than protecting Trump from his dalliances with porn stars and selling out his hotel to the Saudis. 

 

I am not sure of your reference to the plight of the single mother. Are you suggesting an entry level position should not pay a living wage?

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Re: OMG The Socialists R Exploding Heads at CPAC

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Message 6 of 36

@Richva wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@Richva wrote:

I can only say that the current system is not working for the American people and it is refreshing to see the new batch of lawmakers examining possible solutions. 
Except for pay based on need - what solutions have you been refreshed by hearing about??

 


After two years of almost nonstop inability to govern, it is just nice to be see Congress actually addressing Americas issues rather than covering up affairs with porn stars.

 

Who proposed pay based on need?  Was that part of Trump's proposal to bail out the farmers he is killing with his trade war?


Those weeping and gnashing their teeth over the plight of the single mother qualified only for an entry level position. 

 

"Porn stars"??????

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Re: OMG The Socialists R Exploding Heads at CPAC

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@mickstuder wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@mickstuder wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@mandm84 wrote:

Maybe a Socialist Style Pension , Paid Sick Days , Paid Vacation Days ,Lifetime Healthcare etc etc etc  would be a good start for ALL Hard Working Americans ? What do you think or is that just for the privileged Socialists ?


Two thoughts:

 - a person is properly paid based on the value he or she adds to the goods or services offered to the consumer. The cost to the employer includes the items you listed and they then reduce the hourly wage since they are part of the costs.

 

- What is a privileged Socialist?


See herein lies part of the problem - are entire Economic System can be reduced to only Two Thoughts - depending on your frame of reference - they could be

 

Good - Bad ..............Right - Wrong .............Socialist - Capitalist .......Republican - Democrat

 

Would that it was that simple

 

Most Americans believe that a rising tide should lift all boats—that as the economy expands, everybody should reap the rewards. And for two-and-a-half decades beginning in the late 1940s, this was how our economy worked. Over this period, the pay (wages and benefits) of typical workers rose in tandem with productivity (how much workers produce per hour). In other words, as the economy became more efficient and expanded, everyday Americans benefitted correspondingly through better pay. But in the 1970s, this started to change.

 

The gap between productivity and a typical worker’s compensation has increased dramatically since 1973Productivity growth and hourly compensation growth, 1948–2017

 

 

Pay gap.png

 

pay gap 1.png

 

pay gap 2.png

 

pay gap 3.png

 

pay gap 4.png

 

pay gap 5.png

 

 

Since 1973, pay and productivity have diverged.

 

From 1973 to 2017, net productivity rose 77.0 percent, while the hourly pay of typical workers essentially stagnated—increasing only 12.4 percent over 44 years (after adjusting for inflation).

 

This means that although Americans are working more productively than ever, the fruits of their labors have primarily accrued to those at the top and to corporate profits, especially in recent years.

 

Why this happened—and how we can fix it

 

Rising productivity provides the potential for substantial growth in the pay for the vast majority.

 

However, this potential has been squandered in recent decades.

 

The income, wages, and wealth generated over the last four decades have failed to “trickle down” to the vast majority largely because policy choices made on behalf of those with the most income, wealth, and power have exacerbated inequality. In essence, rising inequality has prevented potential pay growth from translating into actual pay growth for most workers. The result has been wage stagnation.

 

For future productivity gains to lead to robust wage growth and widely shared prosperity, we need to institute policies that reconnect pay and productivity and restore worker power, such as those in EPI’s First Day Fairness Agenda and the Agenda to Raise America’s Pay. Without such policies, efforts to spur economic growth or increase productivity (the largest factor driving growth) will fail to lift typical workers’ wages.

 

Capitalism has failed the American Worker

 

Source - https://www.epi.org/productivity-pay-gap/

 

As I said, salary is based on the contribution of the worker to the value of the product or service being provided to the consumer. As automation took on more and more of the increased productivity, it was only natural for salaries to not increase.

 

Capitalism has failed the American Worker

 

Can you describe your alternative? 

 

"First DAY Fairness" seems to be based on paying based on the needs of the worker. That brings back the issue of two workers doing the same work but being paid different. Do you support that?

 

 

 


 


So Artificial Intelligence & Automation was responsible for the beginning of the Productivity Gap in the 1970's & 80's

 

No - Pure & Simple Capitalistic Greed was responsible back then & even more so today

 

1. Here’s an example. A Deloitte study of automation in the U.K. found that 800,000 low-skilled jobs were eliminated as the result of AI and other automation technologies. But get this: 3.5 million new jobs were created as well, and those jobs paid on average nearly $13,000 more per year than the ones that were lost.

 

2. The Marlin Steel factory in Baltimore is a classic case of automation driving innovation. When Chinese manufacturers undercut Marlin Steel’s prices for its core wire basket product line, the company was forced to pivot. Marlin Steel purchased robotic wire-forming machines and began focusing on making high-quality precision products for companies such as Boeing and General Motors. It also hired more people and increased wages, attracting workers whose diverse backgrounds complemented the computer-aided production processes around which the factory now revolves.

 

Drew Greenblatt, CEO and owner of Marlin Steel, credits automation with not only providing a lifeline to the company but to its employees as well. “All of a sudden they’re super productive and it’s because we’ve given them the tools — it’s robotics and automation,” he said. “Thank God for robots. If it wasn’t for robots, these guys would be unemployed.”

 

3. Panera Bread announced in April that it would create 10,000 delivery driver and in-café jobs in response to the popularity of its delivery service. High customer demand for ordering soups and sandwiches through the chain’s AI-powered digital platform led the company to decide to expand the service to 40 percent of its stores. The company said that its drivers would enjoy “daytime hours and competitive wages” and would further bolster the customer experience.

Panera Bread’s decision to hire its own drivers rather than outsource deliveries to a third-party service could hint at another automation-driven trend. If all companies have access to the same cost-saving, service-expediting technologies, competitive advantage may come from differentiated customer experience — the sort of unique customer experience that comes from human creativity.

 

Source - https://venturebeat.com/2017/09/07/automation-replaced-800000-workers-then-created-3-5-million-new-j...

 

The only thing all those words prove is that Alston Ghafourifar was not briefed on the issue - it is two people doing the same job being paid differently based on differing needs.

 

It appears that the other contributors were also kept in the dark about the issue.

 

 


 

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Re: OMG The Socialists R Exploding Heads at CPAC

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@rk9152 wrote:

@Richva wrote:

I can only say that the current system is not working for the American people and it is refreshing to see the new batch of lawmakers examining possible solutions. 
Except for pay based on need - what solutions have you been refreshed by hearing about??

 


After two years of almost nonstop inability to govern, it is just nice to be see Congress actually addressing Americas issues rather than covering up affairs with porn stars.

 

Who proposed pay based on need?  Was that part of Trump's proposal to bail out the farmers he is killing with his trade war?

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Re: OMG The Socialists R Exploding Heads at CPAC

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@mandm84 wrote:

Of course right around the Reagan years our Unions were demonized and stabbed in the back. What was the result ?

Employer Pensions disappeared , Employer Healthcare disappeared and Jobs disappeared through outsourcing overseas. Hey but our CEOs pay went from 25 times the average worker to 400 times by the year 2000.

Now that's Republican backed Capitalism !!


Reagan years???

Image result for union membership by year

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@Richva wrote:

I can only say that the current system is not working for the American people and it is refreshing to see the new batch of lawmakers examining possible solutions. 
Except for pay based on need - what solutions have you been refreshed by hearing about??

 

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