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Treasured Social Butterfly
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Re: Note to Seniors from Dems

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Message 11 of 68

While EHB (employer health benefits) have also gone up in price - for the employer and the employee - and deductibles and out of pocket cost have also gone up, many employees to keep down their part of the premium have gone to High Deducible plans with a HSA (Health savings account).  This is how the employees can put away tax free money to build up that deductible.

 

Many employers may also contribute to a FSA (flexible savings account) which allows the employee to cover some incidental medical care and even OTC meds.  There are a lot of rules connected to them as far as what they can spend it on but it works out well for the employees and their families.

 

There are lots of tax advantages to employers providing health insurance to employees and to the employees too - this is part of the employees compensation or cost of employment which does not have any employment taxes assessed on it - not for the employee and not matched by the employer.

Employment taxes meaning - Social Security and Medicare payroll withholding.

 

Government plans like the FEHB (Federal Employee Health Benefits) are also exempt from participation in some of the M4A plans or bills in Congress right now - can't remember about Bernie's specifically but they are exempt under the Medicare for America proposal.

 

So when we start talking some single payer system, believe me, when I say there is more than health care related finances that have to be considered - specifically tax advantage to employers and employees.

 

Let's face it, people can choose another plan that would cover a higher part of the cost for little more in premiums - especially if those premiums are subsidized.  They Don't.

 

Let's face it, if people were concerned about having to pay some out of pocket cost - they would begin to save for them, even if just a bit at a time - They don't.

 

Let's face it, if people were more concerned about their health, they would try to live a healthier lifestyle - Many Don't.

 

Medicare Advantage plans have a pretty high deductible and out of pocket cost - they also work in networks, with plenty of services which have to be pre-approved for coverage.  They use step therapy.  But here again, they also offer other services not offered in traditional Medicare.  Medicare has to approve each of these designs - the reason we have Medicare Advantage plans is it is a way to manage the care of these beneficiaries.  For the areas that have this option, seniors are opting for them and that % is growing.  Ever ask yourself WHY?

 

____________________________________

 

I know why.

 

When private health insurance lobbyists design our healthcare system, it gets very complicated.

 

 

 

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Valued Social Butterfly
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Re: Note to Seniors from Dems

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Message 12 of 68

The largest individual income tax expenditure in 2017 was the provision that allows households to exclude from taxable income the value of employer-provided health insurance.

 

CBPP 2018 - Policy Basics - Federal Tax Expenditures

 

 

* * * * It's Always Something . . . Roseanne Roseannadanna
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Re: Note to Seniors from Dems

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Message 13 of 68

@gordyfl 

 

While EHB (employer health benefits) have also gone up in price - for the employer and the employee - and deductibles and out of pocket cost have also gone up, many employees to keep down their part of the premium have gone to High Deducible plans with a HSA (Health savings account).  This is how the employees can put away tax free money to build up that deductible.

 

Many employers may also contribute to a FSA (flexible savings account) which allows the employee to cover some incidental medical care and even OTC meds.  There are a lot of rules connected to them as far as what they can spend it on but it works out well for the employees and their families.

 

There are lots of tax advantages to employers providing health insurance to employees and to the employees too - this is part of the employees compensation or cost of employment which does not have any employment taxes assessed on it - not for the employee and not matched by the employer.

Employment taxes meaning - Social Security and Medicare payroll withholding.

 

Government plans like the FEHB (Federal Employee Health Benefits) are also exempt from participation in some of the M4A plans or bills in Congress right now - can't remember about Bernie's specifically but they are exempt under the Medicare for America proposal.

 

So when we start talking some single payer system, believe me, when I say there is more than health care related finances that have to be considered - specifically tax advantage to employers and employees.

 

Let's face it, people can choose another plan that would cover a higher part of the cost for little more in premiums - especially if those premiums are subsidized.  They Don't.

 

Let's face it, if people were concerned about having to pay some out of pocket cost - they would begin to save for them, even if just a bit at a time - They don't.

 

Let's face it, if people were more concerned about their health, they would try to live a healthier lifestyle - Many Don't.

 

Medicare Advantage plans have a pretty high deductible and out of pocket cost - they also work in networks, with plenty of services which have to be pre-approved for coverage.  They use step therapy.  But here again, they also offer other services not offered in traditional Medicare.  Medicare has to approve each of these designs - the reason we have Medicare Advantage plans is it is a way to manage the care of these beneficiaries.  For the areas that have this option, seniors are opting for them and that % is growing.  Ever ask yourself WHY?

 

* * * * It's Always Something . . . Roseanne Roseannadanna
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Re: Note to Seniors from Dems

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Message 14 of 68

We need a Public Option - Medicare before 65 IF YOU WANT IT.

 

It's a trap for taxpayers.

 

The underinsured is steadily growing as more companies are opting for cheaper plans - like the Obamacare Bronze Plans. Less coverage but smaller to no premiums for employees. Healthy employees will likely accept the Bronze plan offered unless they see high medical bills in their future, in which case they will pay the extra premiums for the Public Option. 

 

So, if your healthy, you'll stay in the employer underinsured policy. If you come down with a serious chronic illness, you'll switch to the government program for less out of pocket expenses. This is good for the private insurance companies as they will free themselves of medical bills by the unhealthy people, but it will help cripple the government program. Another bonanza for the private insurance companies.

 

Remember, seniors, people with disabilities, serious illnesses all get dumped onto government programs. Private insurance companies like to keep healthy people only.

 

Medicare for all as the ONLY option will simply get Republicans elected.

 

Everyone knows that Bernie Sanders's signature issue is "Medicare for All". Yet....

 

poll sanders trump.png

and...

 

The candidate who is seen as the strongest on health care is Sen. Bernie Sanders, the candidate who unapologetically backs "Medicare for All".

 

"The candidate best able to handle healthcare":

bernie best healthcare.jpg

 

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/bulletpoint-bernie-sanders-is-running-ahead-of-the-pack-on-heal...

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Re: Note to Seniors from Dems

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Message 15 of 68

@williamb39198 wrote:

Whatever system that we can come up with for healthcare coverage, may it include:

-coverage for all, which includes, whether private coverage, major plan participation, and an option to retain your policy, but also that everyone pays ”something towards” the plan...and to get away from the “ER” healthcare plan

-a focus on “preventative healthcare”. At least to give everyone yearly checkups, or checkups and tests when needed, to head off major issues, if possible. This in itself, may help to save on costs, and to help promote a healthier populace

 

And something that Gordy mentioned earlier on long term care. We have been thru the process twice now with parents needing total assisted care. In order for them to obtain Medicaid assistance, they had to become “poor”, not that they had much to begin with. Plus it took a number of months to jump thru all the hoops. Plus legal assistance was needed to apply. It looked like they were both going to receive the aid, but unfortunately both passed away before being finalized...maybe some improvements to this process could be included in the coverage. 


Republicans rely on people who refuse to do what they're told to do, even when the results are all good. The GOPerLords call it "The American Spirit", and their recalcitrant lofos take pride in NOT recycling, NOT buckling up, NOT getting vaccinated and NOT having health insurance.

 

Nothing that makes America Great could have been done with this infantile egomania, but pandering to it gets Republicans elected. So give the devil his due, Medicare for all as the ONLY option will simply get Republicans elected so as soon as they can arrange it, there will be Medicare for NONE as they bankrupt the system along with SS.

 

We need a Public Option - Medicare before 65 IF YOU WANT IT - and a restoration of the mandate that nobody rides for free with considerably increased fines for those who want to rely on the ER for their care with us picking up the tab.

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Re: Note to Seniors from Dems

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Message 16 of 68

Whatever system that we can come up with for healthcare coverage, may it include:

-coverage for all, which includes, whether private coverage, major plan participation, and an option to retain your policy, but also that everyone pays ”something towards” the plan...and to get away from the “ER” healthcare plan

-a focus on “preventative healthcare”. At least to give everyone yearly checkups, or checkups and tests when needed, to head off major issues, if possible. This in itself, may help to save on costs, and to help promote a healthier populace

 

And something that Gordy mentioned earlier on long term care. We have been thru the process twice now with parents needing total assisted care. In order for them to obtain Medicaid assistance, they had to become “poor”, not that they had much to begin with. Plus it took a number of months to jump thru all the hoops. Plus legal assistance was needed to apply. It looked like they were both going to receive the aid, but unfortunately both passed away before being finalized...maybe some improvements to this process could be included in the coverage. 

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Re: Note to Seniors from Dems

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Message 17 of 68

The number of Americans classified as underinsured has more than doubled since 2003, according to research by the Commonwealth Fund.


Last year, 28% of adults aged 19 to 64 were "underinsured". That's a good 41 million people for those keeping track.


Not only is that a frightening number on its own, but it represents a steep climb over a mere 13-year stretch.


_______________________________


2003 is a long time ago.


_______________________________


"Since" 2003 "over a mere 13-year stretch" means 2003 to 2016. (2016 is not "a long time ago").


Let's look at 2003 to 2018. (Not a long time ago).


The underinsured rate increased the most among U.S. adults enrolled in employer-sponsored health plans. That rate grew from 17% in 2010 to 28% in 2018, reaching about 44 million U.S. adults in 2018, according to the Commonwealth Fund.


However, U.S. adults enrolled in health plans purchased in the individual insurance market had higher underinsured rates than those enrolled in employer-sponsored coverage.


Among U.S. adults with coverage from the individual market, the underinsured rate increased from 37% in 2010 to 42% in 2018.

 

Underinsured adults:


healthcare under insured.jpg

 

 

"Medicare for All" solves this problem, as well.

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Re: Note to Seniors from Dems

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Message 18 of 68

@afisher wrote:

   It is amusing to read the "reasons why" as posted by some.    They seem not to have read ANY of the proposals as to how the system could be designed - hint:  any= more than one.   Instead they continue on with mindless platitudes that they have learned not from any healthcare professional.  

   One does have to wonder what sort of human being says that people in the middle and lower working groups should just die because they can't afford a policy and deductible that will actually save their lives.  

   The cheapest healthcare is the preventive care model, where people have affordable access to a healthcare professional before a serious condition develops.   

 

    A recent outlier death:   a 26 yo got kicked off his parents health insurance plan.   As a diabetic, he had problems covering the cost of the medication which he received via his parents plan.   So he went to find a less expensive drug - and he found one,   Unfortunately, it was not meant to treat his diabetic needs and he died.     But hey, the drug was cheaper and the pharmacy that sold it to him - didn't bother to discuss and contraindications or tell him that it was not suitable for him.   


     Some are set on ignoring reality - so here you go, the part that some want to ignore / deny:  https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/the-follow-up-appointment/2019/08/17/1be5ded6-b936-11e9-a091...      Southern Missouri - red state

PRO-LIFE is Affordable Healthcare for ALL .
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Re: Note to Seniors from Dems

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Message 19 of 68

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

@Laurie42010 wrote:

@NOTHAPPENING wrote:

@Laurie42010 wrote:

I can't help but ask, are the people so opposed to the "Medicare for All" system that afraid of the whole health insurance and pharma industry?  These organizations/corporations should be more concerned about the care/coverage for the people to keep them healthy BEFORE serious illness strikes and not we will cover THIS if/when illness appears, which is all about a profit driven system not a overall welfare of human life system, imo.  If they have money to put into the whole lobbist system that again shows they will invest in "other" before the actual people.


I can't answer for "all" the people opposed to Medicare for all but I can answer for myself.

 

I am against Medicare for All because:

 

Only 9% of the people in America (30 million are without healthcare insurance) AND the government will take over healthcare for all 330 million people.  Why should 91% not have what they're used to with the old healthcare insurance they currently have?

 

They could more easily put the 30 million without healthcare on Medicaid and through their filing of tax forms, determine who is able to afford the (Medicaid) premiums and tax them if appropriate.

 

Government has a way of inefficiently doing things.

 

There will be more constraints than now with existing insurance (one size doesn't fit all).

 

Medicare for All will be charged on a basis that is similar to Medicare payments (the more money you earn, the more the premiums are).  No insurance works like that (except government plans).


I refer to the below article from Feb. 11, 2019 - CNBC - "This is the real reason most Americans file for bankruptcy"

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/11/this-is-the-real-reason-most-americans-file-for-bankruptcy.html

 

This my family experienced first hand back in the mid 70's when my mother had cancer, went through all the combative "experimental" measures to keep her alive for her three young daughters, but was just not ever going to be enough to save her. So.....why don't they (health industry) stop spending money on lobbying and put it to r&d to find cures?


They could more easily put the 30 million without healthcare on Medicaid and through their filing of tax forms, determine who is able to afford the (Medicaid) premiums and tax them if appropriate.

 

Experimental measures is a problem with conventional insurance, Medicare, and Medicaid.

 

This would take care of this situation!


If Universal Health Care programs are so bad, then why hasn't any country who has adopted one rescinded it?  The question is easily answered ............. health statistics prove it.  Universal Health Care Plans bring less cost per person, far better health statistics, and far better overall health for a county's citizens.  Your fear is unfounded.


I can't answer your question very easily but I can tell you one thing - if you poll people that have existing medical plans (private & Medicare) and you asked them would they trade for a "Medicare for All" system with unknown costs, unknown benefits, unknown deductibles, unknown limitations on coverages, can you guess how the poll would come out?

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Re: Note to Seniors from Dems

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Message 20 of 68

   It is amusing to read the "reasons why" as posted by some.    They seem not to have read ANY of the proposals as to how the system could be designed - hint:  any= more than one.   Instead they continue on with mindless platitudes that they have learned not from any healthcare professional.  

   One does have to wonder what sort of human being says that people in the middle and lower working groups should just die because they can't afford a policy and deductible that will actually save their lives.  

   The cheapest healthcare is the preventive care model, where people have affordable access to a healthcare professional before a serious condition develops.   

 

    A recent outlier death:   a 26 yo got kicked off his parents health insurance plan.   As a diabetic, he had problems covering the cost of the medication which he received via his parents plan.   So he went to find a less expensive drug - and he found one,   Unfortunately, it was not meant to treat his diabetic needs and he died.     But hey, the drug was cheaper and the pharmacy that sold it to him - didn't bother to discuss and contraindications or tell him that it was not suitable for him.   

PRO-LIFE is Affordable Healthcare for ALL .
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