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Honored Social Butterfly

Here's A Personal Responsibility That Cost Nothing To Do -'But It STILL Doesn't Get Done

Here is a personal responsibility task that cost nothing to do but it STILL doesn't get done.  I would think that this would be of utmost importance to those getting up in age.

 

Why is making some decisions about ones life so hard for people to do ?  

They don't think about finances, they don't give any direction as to what they want when at life's end.

 

They end up going to the hospital either directed by them or somebody else and if there is no directive, they are kept alive - costing lots of health care dollars which in the final regards makes no difference.

 

KHN - Many Still Sidestep End-of-life Planning

 

KHN - Jump-Starting Hard Conversations As The End Nears

 

Or this situation begin to happen, creating conflict between saving a life or letting it pass - Do people really want to experience their naturally occurring end of life in some ER or would they want to die at home surrounded by friends and family.

Most people say they want to do it at home.

KHN - Influx of Elderly Patients Forces ER to Practice Comfort Care 

 

 

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Honored Social Butterfly

Scout was right on target with his post and RK was dead wrong. The Republicans claim to be a party that wants to keep the government out of our lives, but in reality, they are just the opposite.

Honored Social Butterfly


@CriticalThinking wrote:

Scout was right on target with his post and RK was dead wrong. The Republicans claim to be a party that wants to keep the government out of our lives, but in reality, they are just the opposite.


Any specifics or is "scout's right and rk is wrong" as deep as the thinking goes?

 

Let's face it - it was not a Republican President that tried to decree that little boys got to use the school "girls rooms".

Honored Social Butterfly


@rk9152 wrote:

@CriticalThinking wrote:

Scout was right on target with his post and RK was dead wrong. The Republicans claim to be a party that wants to keep the government out of our lives, but in reality, they are just the opposite.


Any specifics or is "scout's right and rk is wrong" as deep as the thinking goes?

 

Let's face it - it was not a Republican President that tried to decree that little boys got to use the school "girls rooms".


Once again rk is trolling with totally off-topic comments.

 

He does however point out a serious flaw in Republican position, which is really Fundie Fanatic position, on transgendered people.

 

The whole argument is Biblical, and the Bible talks about specific roles for male and female.
But the bible ALSO talks about a flat earth (how else can it have "4 corners"?), a geocentric Universe that is 6004 years old and people who live for hundreds of years. All that has been discarded by mainline churches who understand the Bible uses poetry and metaphors, but Fundies insist every word must be literally true.

 

This leads Fundies to think "Male" and "Female" must apply only to a person's plumbing when the reality is your gender identity is determined by your wiring. So sorry fundies and wingers, the bible is right, you just don't understand how to read it. Not a problem... until you insist on writing laws that support your erroneous beliefs.

Honored Social Butterfly


@Olderscout66 wrote:

Once again rk is trolling with totally off-topic comments.

 



And now you have gone completely off-topic.  Nothing about the topic has anything to do about the Bible, religious beliefs, etc.

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@Olderscout66 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@CriticalThinking wrote:

Scout was right on target with his post and RK was dead wrong. The Republicans claim to be a party that wants to keep the government out of our lives, but in reality, they are just the opposite.


Any specifics or is "scout's right and rk is wrong" as deep as the thinking goes?

 

Let's face it - it was not a Republican President that tried to decree that little boys got to use the school "girls rooms".


Once again rk is trolling with totally off-topic comments.

 

He does however point out a serious flaw in Republican position, which is really Fundie Fanatic position, on transgendered people.

 

The whole argument is Biblical, and the Bible talks about specific roles for male and female.
But the bible ALSO talks about a flat earth (how else can it have "4 corners"?), a geocentric Universe that is 6004 years old and people who live for hundreds of years. All that has been discarded by mainline churches who understand the Bible uses poetry and metaphors, but Fundies insist every word must be literally true.

 

This leads Fundies to think "Male" and "Female" must apply only to a person's plumbing when the reality is your gender identity is determined by your wiring. So sorry fundies and wingers, the bible is right, you just don't understand how to read it. Not a problem... until you insist on writing laws that support your erroneous beliefs.


"Off topic comments"??? The whole point was the off topic nature of ct's post. And then you respond with the bible, Fundies, flat earth, poetry, metaphors, plumbing, etc.

 

What does any of that have to do with Gail's excellent point?

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RK asked, "Any specifics on how the Republican Party invades your personal life?"

Here are a few:

 

  • They oppose gambling
  • They oppose the use of marijuana
  • They refuse to let someone suffering from the intense pain of advanced cancer end their own life
  • They refuse to allow a woman to decide if she should continue with her pregnancy
  • They oppose a drug which will prevent a pregnancy
  • They often oppose giving out condoms and other birth control options
  • etc.
Honored Social Butterfly


@CriticalThinking wrote:

RK asked, "Any specifics on how the Republican Party invades your personal life?"

Here are a few:

 

  • They oppose gambling
  • They oppose the use of marijuana
  • They refuse to let someone suffering from the intense pain of advanced cancer end their own life
  • They refuse to allow a woman to decide if she should continue with her pregnancy
  • They oppose a drug which will prevent a pregnancy
  • They often oppose giving out condoms and other birth control options
  • etc.

Did rk really ask that question with regard to this topic? Does any of the above have any relationship to the topic?

 

The topic is one of importance to seniors and certainly deserving of more than petty partisanship.

Honored Social Butterfly


@rk9152 wrote:

@CriticalThinking wrote:

RK asked, "Any specifics on how the Republican Party invades your personal life?"

Here are a few:

 

  • They oppose gambling
  • They oppose the use of marijuana
  • They refuse to let someone suffering from the intense pain of advanced cancer end their own life
  • They refuse to allow a woman to decide if she should continue with her pregnancy
  • They oppose a drug which will prevent a pregnancy
  • They often oppose giving out condoms and other birth control options
  • etc.

Did rk really ask that question with regard to this topic? Does any of the above have any relationship to the topic?

 

The topic is one of importance to seniors and certainly deserving of more than petty partisanship.


ah yes...rk says stay on topic yet his previous post says..

Any specifics or is "scout's right and rk is wrong" as deep as the thinking goes?

 

Let's face it - it was not a Republican President that tried to decree that little boys got to use the school "girls rooms".

 

Thats not the topic either is it? 

So it begins.
Honored Social Butterfly


@MIseker wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@CriticalThinking wrote:

RK asked, "Any specifics on how the Republican Party invades your personal life?"

Here are a few:

 

  • They oppose gambling
  • They oppose the use of marijuana
  • They refuse to let someone suffering from the intense pain of advanced cancer end their own life
  • They refuse to allow a woman to decide if she should continue with her pregnancy
  • They oppose a drug which will prevent a pregnancy
  • They often oppose giving out condoms and other birth control options
  • etc.

Did rk really ask that question with regard to this topic? Does any of the above have any relationship to the topic?

 

The topic is one of importance to seniors and certainly deserving of more than petty partisanship.


ah yes...rk says stay on topic yet his previous post says..

Any specifics or is "scout's right and rk is wrong" as deep as the thinking goes?

 

Let's face it - it was not a Republican President that tried to decree that little boys got to use the school "girls rooms".

 

Thats not the topic either is it? 


It was in response to another poster's "The Republicans claim to be a party that wants to keep the government out of our lives, but in reality, they are just the opposite".

 

Now, do you have any thoughts on Gail's excellent post??

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@rk9152 wrote:

@CriticalThinking wrote:

RK asked, "Any specifics on how the Republican Party invades your personal life?"

Here are a few:

 

  • They oppose gambling
  • They oppose the use of marijuana
  • They refuse to let someone suffering from the intense pain of advanced cancer end their own life
  • They refuse to allow a woman to decide if she should continue with her pregnancy
  • They oppose a drug which will prevent a pregnancy
  • They often oppose giving out condoms and other birth control options
  • etc.

Did rk really ask that question with regard to this topic? Does any of the above have any relationship to the topic?

 

The topic is one of importance to seniors and certainly deserving of more than petty partisanship.


This time you are correct. we are doing just that in a couple of weeks, when we changed Dr's they didn't transferred to the new one.  so I am requesting the forms for a living will. And we have already power of attys

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Asking a person do a health care directive or assign a health care power of attorney has nothing to do with politics, GOP or death panels - it is a personal decision.

 

The subject person can stipulate that ALL reasonable efforts be administered to save them for the longest time possible - They can stipulate that they want to be fed and kept alive by all possible means for as long as possible.  They can specify that they want to be revived until it does not work anymore.

 

They can say this directly in a document or they can assign a health carempowermof attorney and then give this chosen person their directive of wants.

 

Or they can opt for nothing . . . .

 

The important thing is to have the direction set down in writing so that others who need to know your wants and desires know how to proceed.

 

It is the persons decision - whatever they based the decision upon - they just need to make this decision and make it in writing.

 

 

Honored Social Butterfly


@GailL1 wrote:

Asking a person do a health care directive or assign a health care power of attorney has nothing to do with politics, GOP or death panels - it is a personal decision.

 

The subject person can stipulate that ALL reasonable efforts be administered to save them for the longest time possible - They can stipulate that they want to be fed and kept alive by all possible means for as long as possible.  They can specify that they want to be revived until it does not work anymore.

 

They can say this directly in a document or they can assign a health carempowermof attorney and then give this chosen person their directive of wants.

 

Or they can opt for nothing . . . .

 

The important thing is to have the direction set down in writing so that others who need to know your wants and desires know how to proceed.

 

It is the persons decision - whatever they based the decision upon - they just need to make this decision and make it in writing.

 

 


True, asking a person to do a health care directive or assign a health care power of attorney should have nothing to do with politics or death panels but the GOP made it political and railed against allowing Medicare to pay for the physicians time by calling that 'death panels'. There was nothing in the ACA requiring that anyone to have that discussion but still many on the right attacked it for setting up 'death panels'.

 

It always seemed to me that the person I wanted making the decision about end of life care was me. That seems like the one person I could trust to make the decision that I would agree with.

Honored Social Butterfly


@GailL1 wrote:

Asking a person do a health care directive or assign a health care power of attorney has nothing to do with politics, GOP or death panels - it is a personal decision.

 

 

Good topic Gail, in fact yesterday my wife and I were discussing this type topic and made some decisions for ourselves.

 

Back in 1999 my mother was diagnosed with bone cancer and was urged to take chemo treatments, but years earlier we had seen my sister and sister-in-law suffer through them.  So she made sure that everyone knew her wishes not to undergo treatments, and she wanted to die at home.  Then even made her own funeral arrangements along the way.

 

As a post script, note how some continue to make every topic into a partisan diatribe?


Honored Social Butterfly

This is only a problem because of the religious fanatics of the forced Birther ilk. Not only do they insist every pregnancy be carried to term (including those zeka-viris kids who are born without brains and 16oz "premies") they demand we allow their kind to maintain cadavers for them to play with, ibid Terri Schiavo who was BRAIN DEAD for FIFTEEN YEARS, but occupying a bed in an ICU that was unavailable for living patients that entire time.

 

Once again this is ONLY a problem in America because we're the ONLY country dumb enough to elect Republicans who think medical decisions should be made by politicians, not doctors.

 

 

Honored Social Butterfly


@Olderscout66 wrote:

This is only a problem because of the religious fanatics of the forced Birther ilk. Not only do they insist every pregnancy be carried to term (including those zeka-viris kids who are born without brains and 16oz "premies") they demand we allow their kind to maintain cadavers for them to play with, ibid Terri Schiavo who was BRAIN DEAD for FIFTEEN YEARS, but occupying a bed in an ICU that was unavailable for living patients that entire time.

 

Once again this is ONLY a problem in America because we're the ONLY country dumb enough to elect Republicans who think medical decisions should be made by politicians, not doctors.

 

 Totally off topic. Merely an effort to attack Republicans, "Right to Life", and, of course, religious people.


 

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A very good point, Gail. Well, phrased and well documented.

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Trusted Social Butterfly


@Olderscout66 wrote:

This is only a problem because of the religious fanatics of the forced Birther ilk. Not only do they insist every pregnancy be carried to term (including those zeka-viris kids who are born without brains and 16oz "premies") they demand we allow their kind to maintain cadavers for them to play with, ibid Terri Schiavo who was BRAIN DEAD for FIFTEEN YEARS, but occupying a bed in an ICU that was unavailable for living patients that entire time.

 

Once again this is ONLY a problem in America because we're the ONLY country dumb enough to elect Republicans who think medical decisions should be made by politicians, not doctors.

 

 


I appreciate your frustration, scout.  Those guys do cause ANY patience a person might have left for their outright foolishness to dry up and blow away. Still....ONLY is the kind of thing nit-pickers live on.

It gives 'them' the opportunity to say, "SEE...SEE!!!!!".  And guess who 'eats it up'.

 

Gail is right about the responsibilty at 'end of life'.  It is, after all, 'our life'.  In consideration of other good members of society we should avoid imposing a hardship, financially or ethically, on other good members of society. My son says, "Now, THAT"S not right" frequently...especially in today's political climate.  Wish I could type it like he says it...he's mastered the art.

 

You're right too........everything you said is right on....ONLY too many people turned black when you swung the tar-brush.  Don't waste good tar like that.  They'll claim they have to replenish their supply cause you used it all up.  See how that goes?

Honored Social Butterfly


@umbarch64 wrote:

@Olderscout66 wrote:

This is only a problem because of the religious fanatics of the forced Birther ilk. Not only do they insist every pregnancy be carried to term (including those zeka-viris kids who are born without brains and 16oz "premies") they demand we allow their kind to maintain cadavers for them to play with, ibid Terri Schiavo who was BRAIN DEAD for FIFTEEN YEARS, but occupying a bed in an ICU that was unavailable for living patients that entire time.

 

Once again this is ONLY a problem in America because we're the ONLY country dumb enough to elect Republicans who think medical decisions should be made by politicians, not doctors.

 

 


I appreciate your frustration, scout.  Those guys do cause ANY patience a person might have left for their outright foolishness to dry up and blow away. Still....ONLY is the kind of thing nit-pickers live on.

It gives 'them' the opportunity to say, "SEE...SEE!!!!!".  And guess who 'eats it up'.

 

Gail is right about the responsibilty at 'end of life'.  It is, after all, 'our life'.  In consideration of other good members of society we should avoid imposing a hardship, financially or ethically, on other good members of society. My son says, "Now, THAT"S not right" frequently...especially in today's political climate.  Wish I could type it like he says it...he's mastered the art.

 

You're right too........everything you said is right on....ONLY too many people turned black when you swung the tar-brush.  Don't waste good tar like that.  They'll claim they have to replenish their supply cause you used it all up.  See how that goes?


Thanks for taking the time to provide a courteous comment. However, the sad fact is the RW has no shame, so they will react the same way no matter how one phrases opposition to their dogmatic approach to significant problems.

 

Gail seems unaware that even if you provide for a DNR notice and post it in your home (freezers seem the place of choice for detailed instructions) IF a family member or a concerned neighbor finds you collapsed in your home and calls 911, THE RESPONDERS WILL DO EVERYTHING IN THEIR POWER TO RECESSITATE YOU! When you arrive in the ER, those fine folks will continue the treatment until you're "unresponsive" (flatlined) and if a relative shows up before then and wants to continue you on life support, you're on life support.

 

It's not "religious people", those who believe know physical death is not the end.

It's not the medical personnel either, they're bound by the laws.

It's Republicans placating their Fundie Fanatic base who have written the laws in favor of extending medical treatment above any consideration for your wishes or medical evidence you may never regain consciousness.

Honored Social Butterfly


@Olderscout66 wrote:

@umbarch64 wrote:

@Olderscout66 wrote:

This is only a problem because of the religious fanatics of the forced Birther ilk. Not only do they insist every pregnancy be carried to term (including those zeka-viris kids who are born without brains and 16oz "premies") they demand we allow their kind to maintain cadavers for them to play with, ibid Terri Schiavo who was BRAIN DEAD for FIFTEEN YEARS, but occupying a bed in an ICU that was unavailable for living patients that entire time.

 

Once again this is ONLY a problem in America because we're the ONLY country dumb enough to elect Republicans who think medical decisions should be made by politicians, not doctors.

 

 


I appreciate your frustration, scout.  Those guys do cause ANY patience a person might have left for their outright foolishness to dry up and blow away. Still....ONLY is the kind of thing nit-pickers live on.

It gives 'them' the opportunity to say, "SEE...SEE!!!!!".  And guess who 'eats it up'.

 

Gail is right about the responsibilty at 'end of life'.  It is, after all, 'our life'.  In consideration of other good members of society we should avoid imposing a hardship, financially or ethically, on other good members of society. My son says, "Now, THAT"S not right" frequently...especially in today's political climate.  Wish I could type it like he says it...he's mastered the art.

 

You're right too........everything you said is right on....ONLY too many people turned black when you swung the tar-brush.  Don't waste good tar like that.  They'll claim they have to replenish their supply cause you used it all up.  See how that goes?


Thanks for taking the time to provide a courteous comment. However, the sad fact is the RW has no shame, so they will react the same way no matter how one phrases opposition to their dogmatic approach to significant problems.

 

Gail seems unaware that even if you provide for a DNR notice and post it in your home (freezers seem the place of choice for detailed instructions) IF a family member or a concerned neighbor finds you collapsed in your home and calls 911, THE RESPONDERS WILL DO EVERYTHING IN THEIR POWER TO RECESSITATE YOU! When you arrive in the ER, those fine folks will continue the treatment until you're "unresponsive" (flatlined) and if a relative shows up before then and wants to continue you on life support, you're on life support.

 

It's not "religious people", those who believe know physical death is not the end.

It's not the medical personnel either, they're bound by the laws.

It's Republicans placating their Fundie Fanatic base who have written the laws in favor of extending medical treatment above any consideration for your wishes or medical evidence you may never regain consciousness.


This is much too serious an issue to your fellow seniors to be used for your anti-religion "Fundie Fanatic" and "RW has no shame" nonsense. 

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Honored Social Butterfly

   Because the GOP demonized the process, by calling it Death Panels.   ICYMI.    

PRO-LIFE is Affordable Healthcare for ALL .
Honored Social Butterfly


@afisher wrote:

   Because the GOP demonized the process, by calling it Death Panels.   ICYMI.    


This subject involves very difficult but necessary decisions and actions. Yet, as seniors, we must take a realistic approach. And how sad it is that an individual's burning hatred can cause that person to use such a topic to spew more trash such as the above is.......as I said, sad.

 

And, throw in the inaccuracy about death panels and you have a comment that indicates no interest in the topic, merely a desire to attack those of differing political beliefs.

Honored Social Butterfly


@rk9152 wrote:

@afisher wrote:

   Because the GOP demonized the process, by calling it Death Panels.   ICYMI.    


This subject involves very difficult but necessary decisions and actions. Yet, as seniors, we must take a realistic approach. And how sad it is that an individual's burning hatred can cause that person to use such a topic to spew more trash such as the above is.......as I said, sad.

 

And, throw in the inaccuracy about death panels and you have a comment that indicates no interest in the topic, merely a desire to attack those of differing political beliefs.


I agree about the inacuracy about death panels. Obmacare was going to fund healthcare professionals working with seniors to discuss as you said "very difficult but necessary decisions and actions" about end of life. but, your party painted this as DEATH PANELS to scare people away and discredit this great benifit. Yes indeed, shameful.

 

So it begins.
Honored Social Butterfly

Mortality is a tough subject.
So it begins.
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