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Re: GOP - Marketplace Competition Will Save You

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Message 11 of 69

KidBoy2:  Like the government money that goes to Planned Parenthood abortions?

 

 

Could you please provide proof of this from a credible source?

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Re: GOP - Marketplace Competition Will Save You

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Message 12 of 69

@rk9152  Ahhh shoot.  I meant that diatribe to apply to your last remark about government inefficiency and cost consequences to mickstruder. I should have used the quote box so it got in the right place.  So, anyway that was the intent.  The probably applies further on too so if the shoe fits and all that stuff.

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Re: GOP - Marketplace Competition Will Save You

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Message 13 of 69
rk posted..

An alternate view is that the life guaranteed by the Constitution referred to not having you life taken from you by the government or another.

==================================================

Like the government money that goes to Planned Parenthood abortions?
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Re: GOP - Marketplace Competition Will Save You

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Message 14 of 69

@rk9152  I'll get back to you on this, but you put forward a fallacious assumption, followed by  fallacious equivalencies and used questionable logic. A fallacious conclusion to all this was inevitable.  Not that a valid point is not buried in there somewhere.  It has to be found first. 

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Re: GOP - Marketplace Competition Will Save You

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Message 15 of 69

@umbarch64 wrote:

There are a whole bunch of flawed assumptions and false equivalencies floating around here.

 

Life is a right.  That's a moral principle.  If you say otherwise you risk forfeiture of your own.

 

Life isn't 'just a moral principle', that principle is memorialized in the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, the very foundations of this Nation, the Constitution being technically 'the law of the land' to which compliance of all other law is mandatory. 

 

Is that right so far?  IF so...DO YOU AGREE?   Say NO and a bigger problem than you can ever imagine exists between us.  Since that can only be resolved somewhere other than discussion here, Let us move on as though you said YES.

 

Since Life IS a right, that which enables life to continue must be considered a part of life. Do not provide it and Life is eliminated.  That is not only an act of omission, but an overt action since the ability to provide that necessity is available.  The Constitution says a person cannot be 'deprived of life without due process of law.  I don't think I need belabor this point.

 

Adequate Health Care to enable life to continue is therefore a Right, just as life itself is a Right.

 

That being said...private enterprise has no legitimate right to establish any proviso whatsoever in regard to life or the support system that makes it possible for life to continue.

 

You see where this is going....so I will leave it at that and see what sort of equivocation comes back.

 

 


An alternate view is that the life guaranteed by the Constitution referred to not having you life taken from you by the government or another.

 

How about this - if you are entitled to something that you cannot pay for, someone has to pay for it. So, another is working (free) for you. I do believe we had a civil war to stop that practice.

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Re: GOP - Marketplace Competition Will Save You

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Message 16 of 69

@MIseker wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@Olderscout66 wrote:

Republicans want Insurance companies to operate across State lines for the same reason they let credit card companies operate across State lines - it allows them to screw the customer legally because only the laws of the state they're incorporated in apply to their operations - SCOTUS said so back in the 60's. In the case of credit card companies, they all created legal fictions of being in North Dakota that had no usary laws, which is how you can wind up paying fees and interest that would make a Mafia Don blush instead of the fairly standard "1% per month on the unpaid balance" most of us had BEFORE that GOPer great idea.

 

GOPers also want to allow companies to sell worthless policies that were banned under PPACA because the GOPers know there's lots of mathematically challenged young people out there who will waste their money on policies that are nothing but "cash cows" for the companies and provide no real coverage for the consumer. Republicans say "that's FREEDOM" when it's really more legalized screwing of the 99%.


That last part assumes that 99% of our population are freeloading slugs. I really think that you have a low opinion of your fellow citizens.

 

Most people are quite content to make their own way in life and are not looking to the government to steal another persons property for their own personal benefit.

 

This envy of the property of others is, I believe, contained to a very small portion of our population who obsess over the 1% and the 99%. 


This envy of the property of others..is why we have that big sucking sound of money being funneled to the top. 


Certainly not. It is the constant whining about what someone else has and the desire for the government to take it away and, I guess, give it to the whiners. Take for example here - there are some who cannot post on any topic without some nastiness about the 1%ers. I prefer to live my life and let them live theirs.

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Re: GOP - Marketplace Competition Will Save You

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Message 17 of 69

@mickstuder wrote:

Unfortunately, many in this discussion simply do not understand the principles of Insurance

 

Insurance is about Risk not Competition

 

A 20 year old is going to get cheaper rates on Healthcare than a 60 year old

 

A 20 year old is going to get cheaper rates on Life Insurance then a 60 year old

 

A 60 year old is going to get cheaper rates on Auto Insurance than a 20 year old

 

It doesn't matter if the Insurance is being sold across state lines or the border of a country - it's about risk

 

Life and Health Insurance for a 20 year old in Raqqa Syria is going to cost more than for a 20 year old in South Bend Indiana

 

Selling Health Insurance Across State Lines is not a Regulatory Issue it's too costly a proposition to build new Networks of Doctors and Hospitals and Medical Groups that are spread out over large geographical areas........................and already under contract with existing insurers

 

A Health Insurance Company like United can;t just hang out a sign and say we are now offering coverage in New Hampshire when the Entire Medical Establishment in New Hampshire is under contract with existing Insurers like Aetna

 

 

 

 


Certainly, the entire insurance industry is about risk. However, the individual pricings are competitive. Different companies may offer different packages for different prices and the consumer selects. A big difference between that system and a government run system is that the government has no motivation for efficiency, hence the cost is higher - not necessarily the cost paid by the user but the cost overall and somebody has to pay that.

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Re: GOP - Marketplace Competition Will Save You

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Message 18 of 69

@afisher wrote:

    Gee, one is spouting free-market stuff is not dealing with reality, or at least in the healthcare market.   It is not like any other market, despite them attempting to sell that line.    So here is a question / scenario.    

 

1.   Blood is a precious commodity.    Whole blood is collected from volunteers and it is mostly processed into 3 components:   RBC ( for oxygen carrying capacity), FFP (coagulation factors) and Platelets ( stop bleeding).    Each component is priced separately and it differs from region to region because of the labor costs.   Generally speaking, the testing performed by each Donor Collection Center is standardized and follows the mandatory testing guidelines as required by the FDA.

 

2.    Are blood components just another commodity that may or may not be included in a Healthcare Insurance plan - because some religions groups do not believe in transfusion - so why should they have to pay for something they never would use?

 

3.    What if the insurance plan a person purchased said that they would only cover the cost of 4 units of RBC's but any other blood product or more that 4 units of RBCs - well the consumer is on their own?    And then conumer is in a car wreck (massive injury)  - or the consumer was diagnosed with Cancer that could be treated with chemotherapy ( which often times destroys one's own ability to manufacturer blood components) - is that what supply and demand should mean in healthcare insurance.     Bankruptcy or Death- the consumer is supposed to choose and guess about the unknown, because the Insurance company says so via the "free market" competition. 

 

4.    A mere modicum of basic research indicates that the number of public companies offering HCinsurance are now at 35 - is that enough - assuming that they are all in each area ( which they are not).   

 

Supply / Demand is bs when someone's life is at risk - regardless of the RW denial - as long as it isn't them who is being denied ACCESS.     


How could something that is acquired for distribution by voluntary contribution possibly be confused with the "free market" competition???

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Re: GOP - Marketplace Competition Will Save You

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Message 19 of 69

@KidBoy2 wrote:
mick posted..

If your going to keep repeating Falsehoods and offer no supporting sourcing why bother - every Statute of Reference you've offered to date - I've spent a reasonable amount of time refuting - including citing facts and the Actual Statutes - most BTW were in the link you were cutting and pasting excerpts from so I know you know the facts..........................

=================================================

"If your going to keep repeating Falsehoods and offer no supporting sourcing why bother"

Falsehoods? Like this...


Even before Obamacare there were laws were Heath Insurance Companies could not sell across state lines.

Seat belts...they are great.

Wear Your Seat Belt for Insurance Discounts!
www.carinsurancecomparison.com › Auto Insurance Discounts
Just tell your car insurance agent that you put on your seat belt every time you ... but there are also other seat belt programs available that may help you save.

There are also many discounts for things like anti-lock brakes..air bags, etc.

============================================

Enough of this back and forth as you keep posting things about me that are not true.






Car Insurance Comparison .com - heh heh - thanks - but I reside in the Live Free or Die State where no Car Insurance of any kind is required - the same for Seat Belts

 

Here try this one - It's called Healthcare Insurance Across State Lines Comparison .com - there are several discounts as well

 

https://tinyurl.com/lvem5md

 

Again, Never - Before or After Obamacare was there any Federal Law prohibiting the sale of Health
Insurance Across State lines.....................................it's another Trumpism like the Birther Issue - The Wiretapping Issue & the I Love Muslims Issue

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

( " China if You're Listening - Get Trumps Tax Returns " )

" )
" - Anonymous

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Re: GOP - Marketplace Competition Will Save You

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Message 20 of 69

@Panjandrum  My hope is that citizens of this country will recognize that the words in the Constitution have meaning, that meaning was specific then and is now.  Neither words nor meanings should be tampered with. 

 

For example:  The term Obamacare is a pejorative perversion to denigrate the ACA and the President although he was simply a supporter and contributor to its content.. So...I never use Obamacare, I always use ACA when referring to that program.  That is what the title says it is and that IS what it is.     

 

For a start, we, The People, could insist the Legislature pass a bill stating that Life is a Right and all that is a prerequisite for Life is a Right as well, that has far reaching effect on any subsequent legislation. It will eliminate wiggle-room for angle workers to work the angles, because it sets a standard to which ALL other legislation, like health care, must achieve.

 

I anticipate having more discussion with you, but I am tired now and I must rest. 

 

 

 

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