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Treasured Social Butterfly
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Re: Free Speech

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Message 31 of 101

@rk9152 wrote:

In the early '60s Ayn Rand was on a speaking tour addressing large audiences in such places as Yale, MIT, Princeton, Columbia (the home of the Frankfurt School), and many more.

 

This was before Mario Savio started the "Free Speech Movement" and yet she was "free to speak.

 

Can you imagine that today what with antifa, disinvitations, the need for police escorts, safe zones for the snowflakes, pc, etc..

 

It seems that back then "free speech" really meant "freedom to speak". Today it means "freedom to stop someone else from speaking".


I am not sure of the reason for this rant. Did somebody turn down a permit for the American Nazi Party to march through the streets or something? 

 

 

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Re: Free Speech

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Message 32 of 101

@rk9152 wrote:

@Snoopy48 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

 

 did schumer approve wall in the past

A university can invite anyone they want. I am objecting to the mobs shouting a speaker down or causing a disinvite (sic) with threats of violence.


I can't see your lips, a good thing.

 

Universities make their own decisions based on whatever they want. Are you against people shouting down white supremacist hate speech?

 

Is the TOS "speech suppression"?

 

Once again - A university can invite anyone they want. I am objecting to the mobs shouting a speaker down or causing a disinvite (sic) with threats of violence.


 


The University had the right to base their decision on whatever they chose to, even taking into account the students desires made known by protesting. 

 

Is the TOS "speech suppression"? 


Do you approve of the threat of violence in order to have a speaker not invited, disinvited, or shut down? Not "desires made known" - violence.


The speakers should not be making threats and advocating violence and they wouldn’t get shut down, disinvited or not invited.


What threats has Ann Coulter made???


Guess you have never listened to Ann Coulter.

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Re: Free Speech

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Message 33 of 101

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

Much has been made about the "feelings of the students" but remember, we are not talking about a democratic election making these determinations - we are talking about mobs.

 

That raises two issues - first, what percentage of the student body is the demonstrating mobs? Secondly, let's say only 20% of the student body wants to hear a speaker - are they not entitled to hear him?


The "speaker" has the right to get a permit and speak on public property and the students you speak of have the right to attend. You see ...... it's so simple.


Does anyone have the right to have an appearance cancelled via the threat of violence? Do dissenters have the right to shout down the speaker you mentioned above or do those wanting to hear him have the right to do so?

 

If it's that simple address it.


Yes, the University can cancel anyone's appearance for whatever reason they desire to use.  Don't like it?  Take it to court.

 

Oh, are you referring to the "dissenters" trying to "shout down" the KKK speakers in Charlottesville just before one of the KKK members/supporters ran his vehicle into a crown of "dissenters", killing on woman and injuring dozens?

 

Yes, the protesters have the right to "shout down" hate speech.


Same "Yeah, me too" weak point - same intelligent answer.

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Re: Free Speech

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Message 34 of 101

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@williamb39198 wrote:

@Olderscout66

For sure. Things have changed and not for the good. And it’s not about hate, it’s about seeking the truth. 

 

@rk9152

So much for a wish of courtesy. But, I do agree with you. With trump, his base, trump supporters, trump repubs, freedom caucus, racists, supremists, and ultra right conservatives...things have sunk to an all time new low! Terrible behavior!

 

Never Forget


I'm not sure of your point. Can you point to left wing speakers disinvited over the threat of violence, shouted down, or stopped by mob violence?


Left wing speakers don't promote bigotry, white supremacy, separatism, bash those with different sexual preferences, denigrate those of certain religions, discriminate against women, promote violence by showing up wearing helmets, carrying shields and displaying weapons. That's why they haven't been "dis-invited".


Condoleezza Rice didn't speak at Rutgers because of student protests. Which of your claims above apply to her.

 

John Cornyn"s invitation to speak at TSU was rescinded due to student protests. Is he one of your made up list above?

 

Now, back to the basic question I asked -  Can you point to left wing speakers disinvited over the threat of violence, shouted down, or stopped by mob violence?


Evidently you didn't read this, it answers your question:  

 

Left wing speakers don't promote bigotry, white supremacy, separatism, bash those with different sexual preferences, denigrate those of certain religions, discriminate against women, promote violence by showing up wearing helmets, carrying shields and displaying weapons. That's why they haven't been "dis-invited".


Yep, so snoopy said - another "Yeah, me too". I'll give you the same type answer - what violence does Ann Coulter push? What helmet have you seen on John Cornyn? Which women did Condi Rice discriminate against?

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Message 35 of 101

@Snoopy48 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

 

 did schumer approve wall in the past

A university can invite anyone they want. I am objecting to the mobs shouting a speaker down or causing a disinvite (sic) with threats of violence.


I can't see your lips, a good thing.

 

Universities make their own decisions based on whatever they want. Are you against people shouting down white supremacist hate speech?

 

Is the TOS "speech suppression"?

 

Once again - A university can invite anyone they want. I am objecting to the mobs shouting a speaker down or causing a disinvite (sic) with threats of violence.


 


The University had the right to base their decision on whatever they chose to, even taking into account the students desires made known by protesting. 

 

Is the TOS "speech suppression"? 


Do you approve of the threat of violence in order to have a speaker not invited, disinvited, or shut down? Not "desires made known" - violence.


The speakers should not be making threats and advocating violence and they wouldn’t get shut down, disinvited or not invited.


What threats has Ann Coulter made???

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Re: Free Speech

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Message 36 of 101

@Olderscout66 wrote:

 



Those defending Democracy are not the ones the school administration fears will cause violence. They know the Nazi wing of the GOP will send thugs to attack protesters, just like happened in Charlottsville when one of Der Trumper's "good people" drove his car through a group of PEACEFUL protesters, an act the toadPOTUS has yet to denounce, mostly because he and his supporters think it was the right thing to do.

 

The students HAVE been exposed to the views of those they protest against, rightly determined the speaker is intent on spreading hate and divisiveness and nothing more and that's why they protest. Only the lofos of the Republican base attack things they do not understand because they will not examine the facts.


Well, if you are basing that on Conservatives being Nazis, fascists, alt-right, sexists, homophibes, xenophobes and they eat pet dogs I guess you would have a point. But, your basic assumptions seem to have all the validity of Delta moving to GA for tax breaks.

 

And, since anyone to the right of Che Guevara is "all of the above" to some I guess the kids only get educated indoctrinated on  one narrow political point of view.

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Re: Free Speech

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Message 37 of 101

@sp362 wrote:

rk, in response to your question about a left wing speaker not being allowed to speak.  Off the top of my head I can remember Bill Maher and Berkeley.  I am sure there have been others.


http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/30/living/bill-maher-commencement-speaker/index.html

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Re: Free Speech

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Message 38 of 101

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

Much has been made about the "feelings of the students" but remember, we are not talking about a democratic election making these determinations - we are talking about mobs.

 

That raises two issues - first, what percentage of the student body is the demonstrating mobs? Secondly, let's say only 20% of the student body wants to hear a speaker - are they not entitled to hear him?


The "speaker" has the right to get a permit and speak on public property and the students you speak of have the right to attend. You see ...... it's so simple.


Does anyone have the right to have an appearance cancelled via the threat of violence? Do dissenters have the right to shout down the speaker you mentioned above or do those wanting to hear him have the right to do so?

 

If it's that simple address it.


Yes, the University can cancel anyone's appearance for whatever reason they desire to use.  Don't like it?  Take it to court.

 

Oh, are you referring to the "dissenters" trying to "shout down" the KKK speakers in Charlottesville just before one of the KKK members/supporters ran his vehicle into a crown of "dissenters", killing on woman and injuring dozens?

 

Yes, the protesters have the right to "shout down" hate speech.


"The only thing man learns from history is man learns nothing from history"
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Message 39 of 101

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@williamb39198 wrote:

@Olderscout66

For sure. Things have changed and not for the good. And it’s not about hate, it’s about seeking the truth. 

 

@rk9152

So much for a wish of courtesy. But, I do agree with you. With trump, his base, trump supporters, trump repubs, freedom caucus, racists, supremists, and ultra right conservatives...things have sunk to an all time new low! Terrible behavior!

 

Never Forget


I'm not sure of your point. Can you point to left wing speakers disinvited over the threat of violence, shouted down, or stopped by mob violence?


Left wing speakers don't promote bigotry, white supremacy, separatism, bash those with different sexual preferences, denigrate those of certain religions, discriminate against women, promote violence by showing up wearing helmets, carrying shields and displaying weapons. That's why they haven't been "dis-invited".


Condoleezza Rice didn't speak at Rutgers because of student protests. Which of your claims above apply to her.

 

John Cornyn"s invitation to speak at TSU was rescinded due to student protests. Is he one of your made up list above?

 

Now, back to the basic question I asked -  Can you point to left wing speakers disinvited over the threat of violence, shouted down, or stopped by mob violence?


Evidently you didn't read this, it answers your question:  

 

Left wing speakers don't promote bigotry, white supremacy, separatism, bash those with different sexual preferences, denigrate those of certain religions, discriminate against women, promote violence by showing up wearing helmets, carrying shields and displaying weapons. That's why they haven't been "dis-invited".


"The only thing man learns from history is man learns nothing from history"
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Message 40 of 101

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

 

 did schumer approve wall in the past

A university can invite anyone they want. I am objecting to the mobs shouting a speaker down or causing a disinvite (sic) with threats of violence.


I can't see your lips, a good thing.

 

Universities make their own decisions based on whatever they want. Are you against people shouting down white supremacist hate speech?

 

Is the TOS "speech suppression"?

 

Once again - A university can invite anyone they want. I am objecting to the mobs shouting a speaker down or causing a disinvite (sic) with threats of violence.


 


The University had the right to base their decision on whatever they chose to, even taking into account the students desires made known by protesting. 

 

Is the TOS "speech suppression"? 


Do you approve of the threat of violence in order to have a speaker not invited, disinvited, or shut down? Not "desires made known" - violence.


The speakers should not be making threats and advocating violence and they wouldn’t get shut down, disinvited or not invited.

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