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Re: Free Speech

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Message 41 of 101

 


@rk9152 wrote:

@Olderscout66 wrote:

When Ayn Rand was speaking  without disruption, America had not been transformed into a hotbed of Nazi, KKK and White Supremacist supporters by the Republican Party and their Propaganda Ministry, Fox, breightbart, infowars, and the countless RW conspiracy theorists infesting the Internet.

 

Back in the 1950's and 60's, University students in particular had no real beef with Ms Rand as she was a harmless nutjob pumping her literary fiction, not a major political party seeking to turn America into a Corporate Oligarchy.

 

Today those the GOP wants speaking without interruption are the useful fools they employ to enrage their base while the GOPerLords can pretend to NOT hold the blatant racist, sexist, xenophobic views of the speaker they so carefully nurtured over the years to spew the hate and lies Republicans need to win elections.

 

The college educated see through the GOPer ruse and want no part of the destruction of Democracy and rightfully object to their University/College participation in dismantling Liberty in the name of "free speech".


Besides listing all your wild claims about those you hate - do you think  that an invited speaker should be able to speak to those who want to listen?

 

Additionally, should college students not be exposed to a variety of thinking so as to expand their minds?


Those defending Democracy are not the ones the school administration fears will cause violence. They know the Nazi wing of the GOP will send thugs to attack protesters, just like happened in Charlottsville when one of Der Trumper's "good people" drove his car through a group of PEACEFUL protesters, an act the toadPOTUS has yet to denounce, mostly because he and his supporters think it was the right thing to do.

 

The students HAVE been exposed to the views of those they protest against, rightly determined the speaker is intent on spreading hate and divisiveness and nothing more and that's why they protest. Only the lofos of the Republican base attack things they do not understand because they will not examine the facts.

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Re: Free Speech

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Message 42 of 101

rk, in response to your question about a left wing speaker not being allowed to speak.  Off the top of my head I can remember Bill Maher and Berkeley.  I am sure there have been others.

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Re: Free Speech

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Message 43 of 101

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

Much has been made about the "feelings of the students" but remember, we are not talking about a democratic election making these determinations - we are talking about mobs.

 

That raises two issues - first, what percentage of the student body is the demonstrating mobs? Secondly, let's say only 20% of the student body wants to hear a speaker - are they not entitled to hear him?


The "speaker" has the right to get a permit and speak on public property and the students you speak of have the right to attend. You see ...... it's so simple.


Does anyone have the right to have an appearance cancelled via the threat of violence? Do dissenters have the right to shout down the speaker you mentioned above or do those wanting to hear him have the right to do so?

 

If it's that simple address it.

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Message 44 of 101

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

 

 did schumer approve wall in the past

A university can invite anyone they want. I am objecting to the mobs shouting a speaker down or causing a disinvite (sic) with threats of violence.


I can't see your lips, a good thing.

 

Universities make their own decisions based on whatever they want. Are you against people shouting down white supremacist hate speech?

 

Is the TOS "speech suppression"?

 

Once again - A university can invite anyone they want. I am objecting to the mobs shouting a speaker down or causing a disinvite (sic) with threats of violence.


 


The University had the right to base their decision on whatever they chose to, even taking into account the students desires made known by protesting. 

 

Is the TOS "speech suppression"? 


Do you approve of the threat of violence in order to have a speaker not invited, disinvited, or shut down? Not "desires made known" - violence.


Do you think that the TOS is 'speech suppression'?

 

No - now about the post you were theoretically responding to????


 

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Message 45 of 101

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@williamb39198 wrote:

@Olderscout66

For sure. Things have changed and not for the good. And it’s not about hate, it’s about seeking the truth. 

 

@rk9152

So much for a wish of courtesy. But, I do agree with you. With trump, his base, trump supporters, trump repubs, freedom caucus, racists, supremists, and ultra right conservatives...things have sunk to an all time new low! Terrible behavior!

 

Never Forget


I'm not sure of your point. Can you point to left wing speakers disinvited over the threat of violence, shouted down, or stopped by mob violence?


Left wing speakers don't promote bigotry, white supremacy, separatism, bash those with different sexual preferences, denigrate those of certain religions, discriminate against women, promote violence by showing up wearing helmets, carrying shields and displaying weapons. That's why they haven't been "dis-invited".


Condoleezza Rice didn't speak at Rutgers because of student protests. Which of your claims above apply to her.

 

John Cornyn"s invitation to speak at TSU was rescinded due to student protests. Is he one of your made up list above?

 

Now, back to the basic question I asked -  Can you point to left wing speakers disinvited over the threat of violence, shouted down, or stopped by mob violence?

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Message 46 of 101

@rk9152 wrote:

Much has been made about the "feelings of the students" but remember, we are not talking about a democratic election making these determinations - we are talking about mobs.

 

That raises two issues - first, what percentage of the student body is the demonstrating mobs? Secondly, let's say only 20% of the student body wants to hear a speaker - are they not entitled to hear him?


The "speaker" has the right to get a permit and speak on public property and the students you speak of have the right to attend. You see ...... it's so simple.


"The only thing man learns from history is man learns nothing from history"
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Message 47 of 101

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

 

 did schumer approve wall in the past

A university can invite anyone they want. I am objecting to the mobs shouting a speaker down or causing a disinvite (sic) with threats of violence.


I can't see your lips, a good thing.

 

Universities make their own decisions based on whatever they want. Are you against people shouting down white supremacist hate speech?

 

Is the TOS "speech suppression"?

 

Once again - A university can invite anyone they want. I am objecting to the mobs shouting a speaker down or causing a disinvite (sic) with threats of violence.


 


The University had the right to base their decision on whatever they chose to, even taking into account the students desires made known by protesting. 

 

Is the TOS "speech suppression"? 


Do you approve of the threat of violence in order to have a speaker not invited, disinvited, or shut down? Not "desires made known" - violence.


Do you think that the TOS is 'speech suppression'?


"The only thing man learns from history is man learns nothing from history"
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Message 48 of 101

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@ChasKy53 wrote:


 


The KKK is the "mob" that ran a vehicle into a crowd killing a woman and injuring dozens.

 

Those you refer to have the right to speak on public property, like the KKK did resulting in one of their members or supporters killing a woman and injuring dozens.  A university has the right to refuse to let them speak on their property.

 

Thank goodness that right has not been taken away, or we could end up with the KKK causing the death and injury of college students.

 

Focus - speaking, not running down in a car.


 


Focus ............ Universities have the right to choose who speaks on their property and who doesn't.


Correct - now, do opponents have the right to have a speaker disinvited via the threat of violence? And do opponents have the right to shout down an invited guest in the approved environment for his speech?


Perhaps you should take this to court. It could be done on the grounds that Universities should be required to make their students sit through and listen to hate speeches, influencing them to be white supremacists, homophobes, misogynists, xenophobes, and trump supporters ........... all in the guise of 'freedom of speech'. Perhaps a trump appointed judge would rule in favor of it.


"The only thing man learns from history is man learns nothing from history"
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Message 49 of 101

@rk9152 wrote:

@williamb39198 wrote:

@Olderscout66

For sure. Things have changed and not for the good. And it’s not about hate, it’s about seeking the truth. 

 

@rk9152

So much for a wish of courtesy. But, I do agree with you. With trump, his base, trump supporters, trump repubs, freedom caucus, racists, supremists, and ultra right conservatives...things have sunk to an all time new low! Terrible behavior!

 

Never Forget


I'm not sure of your point. Can you point to left wing speakers disinvited over the threat of violence, shouted down, or stopped by mob violence?


Left wing speakers don't promote bigotry, white supremacy, separatism, bash those with different sexual preferences, denigrate those of certain religions, discriminate against women, promote violence by showing up wearing helmets, carrying shields and displaying weapons. That's why they haven't been "dis-invited".


"The only thing man learns from history is man learns nothing from history"
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Message 50 of 101

Much has been made about the "feelings of the students" but remember, we are not talking about a democratic election making these determinations - we are talking about mobs.

 

That raises two issues - first, what percentage of the student body is the demonstrating mobs? Secondly, let's say only 20% of the student body wants to hear a speaker - are they not entitled to hear him?

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