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Re: EVEN MORE TRUMP-O-NOMICS

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Message 1 of 15

@rk9152 wrote:

@Olderscout66 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@afisher wrote:

    Seriously, the ignoble donald supporters are now relying on the global economy ( free market) to somehow realign and fix the US national debt and increase the GDP to make it fit Donald's  wet-dream number.   All while Donald spews out more nonsense of making great deals and nationalism....what are those folks smoking.      Or is just cover that for the fact that they have no clue about how an economy works. 

     UMB:   I added a link to the chart, most people read the articles...albeit some suffer because they refuse to do so and so they type gibberish.   

 

      Apparently the once debt concerned RW is now prepared to push the US into more debt as Muchkin wants $1T for the Fed to operate with.     And then Donald wants a $1T infrastructure bill.....I wonder if the ignoble donald supporters can add or if they wonder if that will have repercussions in the economy.    


The ignobles are smart enough to know that a "free market" and a "global economy" are not the same thing. How come the smart, elite "nobles" do not know that?


True, but lakes are not fish either, yet they are often inextricably connected as are "free markets" (a mostly theoritical construct) and the Global Economy - a very real feature of modern life.

 

Der Trumper seems to be completely boggled by the notion that countries want multinational agreements to insure their "partner" in the agreement doesn't pull a Der Trumper and refuse to abide by the terms of the agreement because he will only be facing a much smaller single opponent instead of a large group.

 

With the one on one, Der Trumper repeatedly cheated the other party, and that seems to be what he thinks he'll be able to do with other smaller Nations.

 

If Lemontop were not such a notorious fraud and liar, he could do a much better job of negotiating with Nation States who are not concerned with the legal costs of enforcing the agreement.


It is a new concept but President Trump is interested in what is best for the USofA - as should other national leaders. The ideal end result is each gets the best he can for his nation.

 

Fortunately, the people he is negotiating with on the international basis can rise above the childishness of "Lemontop" and deal with the realities of the world.


The entire world is well aware of the fact that trump lies twice as often as he tells the truth, and exactly like banks worldwide, everyone is making sure that all of the liar's claims are carefully vetted, and that the contracts, etc are better than ironclad as far as protecting nations dealing with trump's dishonest government.

 

 

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Re: EVEN MORE TRUMP-O-NOMICS

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Message 2 of 15

@Olderscout66 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@afisher wrote:

    Seriously, the ignoble donald supporters are now relying on the global economy ( free market) to somehow realign and fix the US national debt and increase the GDP to make it fit Donald's  wet-dream number.   All while Donald spews out more nonsense of making great deals and nationalism....what are those folks smoking.      Or is just cover that for the fact that they have no clue about how an economy works. 

     UMB:   I added a link to the chart, most people read the articles...albeit some suffer because they refuse to do so and so they type gibberish.   

 

      Apparently the once debt concerned RW is now prepared to push the US into more debt as Muchkin wants $1T for the Fed to operate with.     And then Donald wants a $1T infrastructure bill.....I wonder if the ignoble donald supporters can add or if they wonder if that will have repercussions in the economy.    


The ignobles are smart enough to know that a "free market" and a "global economy" are not the same thing. How come the smart, elite "nobles" do not know that?


True, but lakes are not fish either, yet they are often inextricably connected as are "free markets" (a mostly theoritical construct) and the Global Economy - a very real feature of modern life.

 

Der Trumper seems to be completely boggled by the notion that countries want multinational agreements to insure their "partner" in the agreement doesn't pull a Der Trumper and refuse to abide by the terms of the agreement because he will only be facing a much smaller single opponent instead of a large group.

 

With the one on one, Der Trumper repeatedly cheated the other party, and that seems to be what he thinks he'll be able to do with other smaller Nations.

 

If Lemontop were not such a notorious fraud and liar, he could do a much better job of negotiating with Nation States who are not concerned with the legal costs of enforcing the agreement.


It is a new concept but President Trump is interested in what is best for the USofA - as should other national leaders. The ideal end result is each gets the best he can for his nation.

 

Fortunately, the people he is negotiating with on the international basis can rise above the childishness of "Lemontop" and deal with the realities of the world.

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Re: EVEN MORE TRUMP-O-NOMICS

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Message 3 of 15

@Olderscout66 wrote:

For those who recently returned from several decades in a cave in Tibet, allow me to introduce you to the American Economy 2018.

 

First off, thanks to Republican deregulation, we have these imaginary things called "derivatives" that are being traded as if they existed so the ones doing the trades can collect commissions, accellerating the redistribution of wealth from the 99% to the 1%.

 

The estimated value of these imaginary things as of 20 Nov 2017  was at minimum $544 trillion, and the high-end estimate is $1.2 quadrillion. The first low-ball estimate is about NINE TIMES the WORLD GDP and the high end is TWENTY TIMES the WORLD GDP.

 

For those who watch Fox, listen to Infowars or never got past first grade, this means the GOPerLords of Wall Street are taking commissions on buying and selling paper that they claim is worth 9 to 20 times as much as everything produced everywhere in the world in a single year. They then take the commissions and buy stocks in actual companies which drives up the price of the stock no matter how the company is doing.

 

The ones doing this actually not people but high speed computers who operate according to complex statistical models that have no regard for what's actually going on in the world and are highly suseptable to fluctuations caused by other high speed computers operating on different algorythms.

 

The recent 1600 point drop in the DJA (largest in history) and subsiquent rapid gain back of 400 of those points still left the largest one day decline the DJA has ever experienced. They tell us the drop was because the stocks were over valued, but how did that happen? Because all those imaginary derivatives wind up creating actual dollars in the unregulated trading that have to go somewhere, and they sure aren't going to be wasted paying taxes or increasing dividends.

 

The bottom line is that thanks to Republican deregulation of Wall Street, we can now experience a total global melt down of financial markets WITHOUT any actual reason, just the interaction of algorythms based on different assumptions using money generated by imaginary products called DERIVATIVES that jrbush FORBID the SEC from regulating or even examining back when they MIGHT have been controlled.

 

Anyone who still thinks the old rules of rational market capitalization or supply and demand have anything to do with how the Stock Market behaves knows nothing about the stock market behaves.


I agree that Bush made a series mistake buying into a Dem concept as described by the NYT - "From his earliest days in office, Mr. Bush paired his belief that Americans do best when they own their own home with his conviction that markets do best when let alone".

 

The first part of that was the creation of the housing bubble and it's collapse. The second part was fine until some idiot came up with the "too big to fail" concept.

 

That sort of craziness can also be attributed to the Reagan era where a compromise was reached - deregulate the banks but make the government responsible for their bad judgement. A perfect example of the fallacy of "compromising" with the Dems.

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Re: EVEN MORE TRUMP-O-NOMICS

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Message 4 of 15

@rk9152 wrote:

@afisher wrote:

    Seriously, the ignoble donald supporters are now relying on the global economy ( free market) to somehow realign and fix the US national debt and increase the GDP to make it fit Donald's  wet-dream number.   All while Donald spews out more nonsense of making great deals and nationalism....what are those folks smoking.      Or is just cover that for the fact that they have no clue about how an economy works. 

     UMB:   I added a link to the chart, most people read the articles...albeit some suffer because they refuse to do so and so they type gibberish.   

 

      Apparently the once debt concerned RW is now prepared to push the US into more debt as Muchkin wants $1T for the Fed to operate with.     And then Donald wants a $1T infrastructure bill.....I wonder if the ignoble donald supporters can add or if they wonder if that will have repercussions in the economy.    


The ignobles are smart enough to know that a "free market" and a "global economy" are not the same thing. How come the smart, elite "nobles" do not know that?


True, but lakes are not fish either, yet they are often inextricably connected as are "free markets" (a mostly theoritical construct) and the Global Economy - a very real feature of modern life.

 

Der Trumper seems to be completely boggled by the notion that countries want multinational agreements to insure their "partner" in the agreement doesn't pull a Der Trumper and refuse to abide by the terms of the agreement because he will only be facing a much smaller single opponent instead of a large group.

 

With the one on one, Der Trumper repeatedly cheated the other party, and that seems to be what he thinks he'll be able to do with other smaller Nations.

 

If Lemontop were not such a notorious fraud and liar, he could do a much better job of negotiating with Nation States who are not concerned with the legal costs of enforcing the agreement.

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Re: EVEN MORE TRUMP-O-NOMICS

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Message 5 of 15

@afisher wrote:

    Seriously, the ignoble donald supporters are now relying on the global economy ( free market) to somehow realign and fix the US national debt and increase the GDP to make it fit Donald's  wet-dream number.   All while Donald spews out more nonsense of making great deals and nationalism....what are those folks smoking.      Or is just cover that for the fact that they have no clue about how an economy works. 

     UMB:   I added a link to the chart, most people read the articles...albeit some suffer because they refuse to do so and so they type gibberish.   

 

      Apparently the once debt concerned RW is now prepared to push the US into more debt as Muchkin wants $1T for the Fed to operate with.     And then Donald wants a $1T infrastructure bill.....I wonder if the ignoble donald supporters can add or if they wonder if that will have repercussions in the economy.    


The ignobles are smart enough to know that a "free market" and a "global economy" are not the same thing. How come the smart, elite "nobles" do not know that?

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Re: EVEN MORE TRUMP-O-NOMICS

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Message 6 of 15

@ChasKy53 wrote:


So I guess the market and economy crashing at the end of Bush Jr's term was a "correction"?  We have basically been practicing your "free market" philosophy for decades, following Regan's tax cuts and economic plan. It has resulted in a drastically shrinking middle class, lower average wages, less people earning enough to pay income taxes, and the largest income and wealth disparity we have had since the 1700's. Now trump and the Republicans have passed a giant tax cut for the wealthiest and somehow expect a different result.  The insanity continues ...............


So I guess if you had an understanding of the realities of the world, you would realize that - yes, Bush's crash was an adjustment - but no, not a solely market driven one. The housing market had been artificially boosted to heights it could not sustain, so the adjustment was unnaturally harsh.

 

By the same token, QE for the past 8 or so years has artificially contained the interest rates and, yes, setting us up for another artificially harsh adjustment.

 

We have not been practicing "my" version of a free market. I have posted that over and over but some will overlook the logic in order to throw in insults. The sort of "free market" we have been practicing would have even shocked Keynes.

 

As to the tax cut - yes it cut the taxes of those who pay taxes - wotta concept!!

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Re: EVEN MORE TRUMP-O-NOMICS

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Message 7 of 15

@Olderscout66 wrote:

For those who recently returned from several decades in a cave in Tibet, allow me to introduce you to the American Economy 2018.

 

First off, thanks to Republican deregulation, we have these imaginary things called "derivatives" that are being traded as if they existed so the ones doing the trades can collect commissions, accellerating the redistribution of wealth from the 99% to the 1%.

Derivatives have existed for years. Why not inform me of exactly the methodology used in redistributing the 99% to the 1%. I say it is the other way around.

 

The estimated value of these imaginary things as of 20 Nov 2017  was at minimum $544 trillion, and the high-end estimate is $1.2 quadrillion. The first low-ball estimate is about NINE TIMES the WORLD GDP and the high end is TWENTY TIMES the WORLD GDP.

Again, explain how the 99% are funding the 1%.

 

For those who watch Fox, listen to Infowars or never got past first grade, this means the GOPerLords of Wall Street are taking commissions on buying and selling paper that they claim is worth 9 to 20 times as much as everything produced everywhere in the world in a single year. They then take the commissions and buy stocks in actual companies which drives up the price of the stock no matter how the company is doing.

38% of all households own stock. Doesn't that damage your credibility of the 99% getting shafted?

 

The ones doing this actually not people but high speed computers who operate according to complex statistical models that have no regard for what's actually going on in the world and are highly suseptable to fluctuations caused by other high speed computers operating on different algorythms.

You as an individual can use this "system" by using stop loss or triggers to buy and sell stock.

 

The recent 1600 point drop in the DJA (largest in history) and subsiquent rapid gain back of 400 of those points still left the largest one day decline the DJA has ever experienced.

Largest point drop but not biggest percentage drop. Many on the left don't understand that when the market is very high, a big point drop is relatively small (%). Look at the percentage drop in 1929.

They tell us the drop was because the stocks were over valued, but how did that happen? Because all those imaginary derivatives wind up creating actual dollars in the unregulated trading that have to go somewhere, and they sure aren't going to be wasted paying taxes or increasing dividends.

 

The bottom line is that thanks to Republican deregulation of Wall Street, we can now experience a total global melt down of financial markets WITHOUT any actual reason, just the interaction of algorythms based on different assumptions using money generated by imaginary products called DERIVATIVES that jrbush FORBID the SEC from regulating or even examining back when they MIGHT have been controlled.

Nonsense.

 

Anyone who still thinks the old rules of rational market capitalization or supply and demand have anything to do with how the Stock Market behaves knows nothing about the stock market behaves.

Again, percentage mean more than the point drop. Leftists should stay out of the market and become the lowest 1%.


 

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Re: EVEN MORE TRUMP-O-NOMICS

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Message 8 of 15

For those who recently returned from several decades in a cave in Tibet, allow me to introduce you to the American Economy 2018.

 

First off, thanks to Republican deregulation, we have these imaginary things called "derivatives" that are being traded as if they existed so the ones doing the trades can collect commissions, accellerating the redistribution of wealth from the 99% to the 1%.

 

The estimated value of these imaginary things as of 20 Nov 2017  was at minimum $544 trillion, and the high-end estimate is $1.2 quadrillion. The first low-ball estimate is about NINE TIMES the WORLD GDP and the high end is TWENTY TIMES the WORLD GDP.

 

For those who watch Fox, listen to Infowars or never got past first grade, this means the GOPerLords of Wall Street are taking commissions on buying and selling paper that they claim is worth 9 to 20 times as much as everything produced everywhere in the world in a single year. They then take the commissions and buy stocks in actual companies which drives up the price of the stock no matter how the company is doing.

 

The ones doing this actually not people but high speed computers who operate according to complex statistical models that have no regard for what's actually going on in the world and are highly suseptable to fluctuations caused by other high speed computers operating on different algorythms.

 

The recent 1600 point drop in the DJA (largest in history) and subsiquent rapid gain back of 400 of those points still left the largest one day decline the DJA has ever experienced. They tell us the drop was because the stocks were over valued, but how did that happen? Because all those imaginary derivatives wind up creating actual dollars in the unregulated trading that have to go somewhere, and they sure aren't going to be wasted paying taxes or increasing dividends.

 

The bottom line is that thanks to Republican deregulation of Wall Street, we can now experience a total global melt down of financial markets WITHOUT any actual reason, just the interaction of algorythms based on different assumptions using money generated by imaginary products called DERIVATIVES that jrbush FORBID the SEC from regulating or even examining back when they MIGHT have been controlled.

 

Anyone who still thinks the old rules of rational market capitalization or supply and demand have anything to do with how the Stock Market behaves knows nothing about the stock market behaves.

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Re: EVEN MORE TRUMP-O-NOMICS

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Message 9 of 15

    Seriously, the ignoble donald supporters are now relying on the global economy ( free market) to somehow realign and fix the US national debt and increase the GDP to make it fit Donald's  wet-dream number.   All while Donald spews out more nonsense of making great deals and nationalism....what are those folks smoking.      Or is just cover that for the fact that they have no clue about how an economy works. 

     UMB:   I added a link to the chart, most people read the articles...albeit some suffer because they refuse to do so and so they type gibberish.   

 

      Apparently the once debt concerned RW is now prepared to push the US into more debt as Muchkin wants $1T for the Fed to operate with.     And then Donald wants a $1T infrastructure bill.....I wonder if the ignoble donald supporters can add or if they wonder if that will have repercussions in the economy.    

PRO-LIFE is Affordable Healthcare for ALL .
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Re: EVEN MORE TRUMP-O-NOMICS

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Message 10 of 15

@rk9152 wrote:

@Olderscout66 wrote:

Trumpettes are beyond reason - Der Trumper brags that he caused the all time high in the Stock Market and they all cheer. Then 2 days later it takes the biggest one-day drop in history, and they claim its Obama's fault.

 

Sad to say, their only civic vitrue is they always VOTE, so if you dislike being represented to the World by a psychopathic jackass, VOTE. He won with 26% of registered voters, he can be defeated by 27%, and in the meantime, get rid of his Republican supporters in Congress next November. Looking better all the time - SCOTUS refused to overturn the Pennsylvania Surpeme Courts decision to end their outlandish Gerrymander, so they may get to go back to being deep purple if not dark blue.


The market adjusts/corrects on a regular basis responding to forces of it's own. Some of the forces that makes it grow is a vibrant economy, increased GDP, lower unemployment, etc. However, those same factors can cause an overgrowth triggering a natural and needed correction.

 

That is the advantage of the free market that I support over the managed market you prefer - it corrects when needed regardless of any political considerations.


So I guess the market and economy crashing at the end of Bush Jr's term was a "correction"?  We have basically been practicing your "free market" philosophy for decades, following Regan's tax cuts and economic plan. It has resulted in a drastically shrinking middle class, lower average wages, less people earning enough to pay income taxes, and the largest income and wealth disparity we have had since the 1700's. Now trump and the Republicans have passed a giant tax cut for the wealthiest and somehow expect a different result.  The insanity continues ...............


"The only thing man learns from history is man learns nothing from history"
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