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Trusted Social Butterfly
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Re: Donald Trump may be the worst President in our country's history

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Message 31 of 89

Chris949972, where did you get this kind of information about President Obama? No doubt from Breitbart or some other non credible right wing source. OlderScout is correct in his post that during Obama's presidency, most of the migrants showing up at our southern border were unaccompanied minors. They were held in facilities with beds, blankets, toothbrushes and soap; not in conditions resembling Nazi concentration camps. Then they were released within 72 hours. You could look this up if you wanted to. 

 

A dead giveaway that your sources comes from the right wing media is your accusing Democrats and President Obama as favoring "open borders". Nothing could be further from the truth. Democrats want secure borders, but with more humane treatment of migrants than holding them in concentration camp conditions.

 

As far as illegal immigrants; Democrats are in favor of cutting off illegal immigration at the source; employers who hire illegal imigrants. As it now stands employers that hire illegal immigrants usually get off with a slap on the wrist and pay a fine that could be handled out of petty cash. Then they go right back to business as usual. 

 

Check out a program from PBS that aired last year titled "Trafficked in America". It documents very well what is at the heart of the illegal immigration problem. Teen agers as young as 14 and 15 years old were literally recruited in Guatemala and Hondouras to come to the United States where they could find work. Then the recruiters place leins on the family's land to finance the trip to the United States. 

 

Here is a link to the DVD if you would like to order or view it:

 

https://www.amazon.com/Frontline-Trafficked-America-DVD-n/dp/B07BZ5HT3S/ref=sr_1_1?crid=15LZ91XE7W1A...

 

There they were hired to work at a poultry processing farm called Trillium Farms in Marion Ohio, a city of 35,000 north of Columbus. Marion is solidly Republican and is the home of Warren Harding, our nation's 29th President who is stil revered in Marion.

 

Once there, those teens were forced to work as much as 12 hours a day in a ppoorly ventilated facility that reeked of chicken waste and ammonia with high heat and humidity, even in winter. They were paid sub minmum wages and lived in company housing. 

 

When the company was busted about five years ago, the company's owners denied any knowledge that the workers were here illegally and under age. The company hired a labor contractor to find workers and the company had no knowledge that the contractor was recruiting under age illegal immigrants. But that is a lie. Surely the company had to realize that perhaps those workers were underage and illegal since they couldn't speak a word of English and Marion Ohio is 1600 miles form the Mexican border. 

 

The point is that the wage and hour laws prohibit anyone under age 18 from working in meat packing and poultry processing plants as well as mandatory overtime if they work more than eight hours in one day or 40 hours in a week. In addition health and safety laws require adequate ventilation in facilities like that poultry processing plant. Then there are the minimum wage laws, both federal and state. In Ohio, the  minimum wage is higher than the federal minimum wage. Also Ohio also requires all employees be covered through the state worker's compensation system and those illegal immigrants were not covered. The list of labor law violations is very long as well as violating the law regarding hiring illegal immigrants. 

 

Those illegal teen agers were given fake social security numbers, but for the most part; they were not paying taxes on the income they were earning. In essence those illegall immigrants were paid "under the table" with most of their earnings sent back to their families or to the labor contractor who filed the lein to cover their cost of transporting to the United States from Central America. 

 

But, in the end the owners of the company just got off with fines and continued with business as usual. The labor contractors were all conviced of human trafficking and given long prison sentences. 

 

So how do I know so much about the laws regarding wage and hours as well as hiring illegal immigrants? Back in the 1990s, I took a course in Employment Law where I learned all that. I also worked for a company that administered Ohio Workers Compensation. There are meat packing plants as well as related poultry processing operations scattered throughout rural Ohio that operate under the radar and away from big cities where they would be more conspicuous. 

 

However Illegall immigrants are a good source of cheap labor. It is not that citizens won't do that kind of work. It is just that they won't work for those sub minimum wages and those horrible working conditions. In addition if someone is legal, they are more likely to complain to authorities about the working conditions and low wages. Plus legal citizens are much more likely to form and join labor unions. Ohio is not a right to work state and organized labor is still strong in many parts of Ohio, especially the large cities; which is why those operations like to locate in rural Republican parts of the state. 

 

There you go, crack down on employers who hire ilegal immigrants and we could nip the problem if illegal immigration at the source. Just ask the question of why would some man or woman living in poverty in Central America spend more than a year's income, risk their life as well as their freedom to come to the United States if there were no way that they could find work in the United States? One major reason why illegal immigration fell so much during Obama's presidency was the recession and a shortage of jobs for illegal immigration. In addition the Obama adminstration stepped up prosecution of employers that hire illegal immigrants. 

 

President Obama wanted to require all employers to use the e-verify system to make sure that anyone that they hired was legally authorized to work and live in the United States. But congress refused to act and the courts struck down Obama's executive order. 

 

Illegal immigration is one problem that can easily be fixed. But the obstacle has always been conservative Republicans. Perhaps one reason is that by actually fixing the problem and attacking the problem at its source would deprive the Republican party from using their key wedge issue to divide Americans. 

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Re: Donald Trump may be the worst President in our country's history

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Message 32 of 89

He is certainly better as president of the United States than Obama. 

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Re: Donald Trump may be the worst President in our country's history

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Message 33 of 89

This country was being crushed under Obama's presidency. Did you support Obama when he first said our borders needed protecting? I'm a registered Democrat who never voted for Obama and as you can tell voted for Trump. I'm sure you favor illegal immigration into our country. I don't. I've seen too many in our prison system on ICE detainers for breaking the law after breaking it once by sneaking in to this country. 

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Re: Donald Trump may be the worst President in our country's history

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Message 34 of 89

The president who did nothing to stop these abuses during his tenure in office should be held more accountable than the president who had to deal with the lawlessness generated by the previous administration's hands off policy. Obama doesn't get a pass because he's no longer in office, especially when Democrats are continuing to fight for those same policies. And that is why this problem lays at Obama's feet. When Democrats vote to uphold the laws of our country then President Trump can continue to deal with the mess Obama left.

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Re: Donald Trump may be the worst President in our country's history

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Message 35 of 89

@ChrisF949972 wrote:

What's amusing is how little you hold Obama accountable for the detention center conditions, or the Democrats who want illegal immigrants to be allowed in our country then won't grant enough aid to CBP so they can maintain adequate facilities. 


What is amazing is you do not know the detainees held during the Obama Administration were unaccompanied minors who were held WITH matresses, actual blankets, soap, showers, 3 meals a day, medical attention AND they were released to competent adults within 72 HOURS, because that is what the law requires.

 

What is disgusting is GOPerBase support ripping infants from their mothers arms and then deporting the mother so the child will NEVER be reunited, and that is EXACTLY what your ToadPOTUS intended BECAUSE IT WOULD TERRORIZE FUTURE REFUGEES!

 

GOPerBase also seem perfectly content to pay donny's BFFs $750/kid/day and give the kids a cement floor to sleep on, a mylar blanket for comfort, no showers, no mattresses, no soap and holding them for MONTHS without a charge of any criminal act. You groused endlessly when President Obama took a day off, and claimed incredible costs for his vacations but cheer when Bonespurs WUSSolini hands HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS to the scum running his Concentration Camps and hiring pedophiles for "guards" to molest pre-teen detainees and demanding no one be allowed to inspect the camps without a two week notice.

 

Is the Republican base REALLY okay with what tRump is doing on the southern border just because of hate for people who are not white and not rich?

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Re: Donald Trump may be the worst President in our country's history

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Message 36 of 89

Lk152-Gee if only democrats  would had funded the WALL and voted to fund humanitarian aid for those  illegals who were already here your whiney post would have been irrelevant. The Dems caused the problem and doing everything to  not solved the problem just to use against Trump and all his other great accomplishments. Typical of a Trump hater.

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Re: Donald Trump may be the worst President in our country's history

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Message 37 of 89

@alferdpacker wrote:

 


There is no question that those who oppose tRump have far more wisdom and intelligence than those that support trump...

 


Of course everyone has their own opinion, and my post had nothing to do with Trump.

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Re: Donald Trump may be the worst President in our country's history

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Message 38 of 89

 


@TxGrandpa2 wrote:

@lk152 wrote:

I still stand by my post from January 2018 as well as my reply to one disagreeing poster who called me an "elitist" as well as the author of this column that I shared. 

 

Calling another person who has studied the subject extensively or has years of experience in a particular field of expertise an "elitist" because their views or statements don't agree with your preconceived beliefs is only showing your disdain for wisdom, experience and education. It is also showing that the person making the accusation is in actuality a very stupid person as well. 

 

 


I would believe that your background is mostly in group health care insurance, especially according to your posts here on this forum.  Are you also to be a financial consultant also?  Where does that make one a greater authority on financial matters than anyone else?  Or for that matter on political matters.

 

Free advice in any matter is also worth everything one spends money on.

 

Wouldn't it be 'elitist' to claim to have more wisdom than other posters here. 


There is no question that those who oppose tRump have far more wisdom and intelligence than those that support trump...

 

44>dolt45
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Re: Donald Trump may be the worst President in our country's history

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Message 39 of 89

@lk152 wrote:

I still stand by my post from January 2018 as well as my reply to one disagreeing poster who called me an "elitist" as well as the author of this column that I shared. 

 

Calling another person who has studied the subject extensively or has years of experience in a particular field of expertise an "elitist" because their views or statements don't agree with your preconceived beliefs is only showing your disdain for wisdom, experience and education. It is also showing that the person making the accusation is in actuality a very stupid person as well. 

 

 


I would believe that your background is mostly in group health care insurance, especially according to your posts here on this forum.  Are you also to be a financial consultant also?  Where does that make one a greater authority on financial matters than anyone else?  Or for that matter on political matters.

 

Free advice in any matter is also worth everything one spends money on.

 

Wouldn't it be 'elitist' to claim to have more wisdom than other posters here. 

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Re: Donald Trump may be the worst President in our country's history

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Message 40 of 89

Chris949972, President Obama is NOT RESPONSIBLE for the conditions on the southern border right now. First, he has been out of office more than 30 months. Second, he never held migrants in such conditions or separated children from their families at the border. 

 

As far as allocating enough money to fund border facilities, that is not the job of the President. If it were, then Trump would have his "big beautiful wall" on the Mexican border by now. But funds are allocated by congress and except for the first two years of his administration; President Obama had to rely on a Republican controlled House of Representatives for appropriating funds. In case you don't know, according to the constitution, all budget matters must originate in the House of Representatives. The President can submit a budget to the congress. But it is up to the congress to approve or change what the President submits. 

 

In fact, President Obama wanted a comprehensive immigration reform bill from congress. The Senate passed a comprehensive immigration bill in 2014 that President Obama said he would sign into law if a similar bill also cleared the House of Representatives. But House Speaker John Boehner never brought that Senate bill up for a vote or even send it to committee.

 

There was enough votes in the House to pass the Senate bill on a bipartisan basis. House Democrats were united in passing the bill. But House Republicans were not as enthusiastic with the "Freedom Caucus" united in opposition. Speaker Boehner never brought the Senate bill up for a vote because of the "Hastert Rule" established by former House Speaker (and convicted sex offender) Dennis Hastert established when he was speaker that a bill wouldn't come up for a vote unless a majority of Republicans in the House were in favor of the bill. Thus the comprehensive immigration bill never was passed despite passing the Senate on a bipartisan vote and enough votes in the House to pass and the President indicating that he would sign it into law. 

 

That bill would have authorized more money to fund judges to hear asylum cases as well as allowing more migrants seeking asylum to be housed elsewhere pending a hearing. No detention camps or separating children from their families. That bill would have allowed a guest worker program allowing immigrants to enter the United States to work in jobs where no citizen was interested in working. That would have solved the problem with many employers hiring illegal immigrants just to fill jobs where they couldn't get citizens to fill. The guest workers would be legal, have legitimate social security numbers, pay taxes and eventually become eligible for benefits as well as become citizens after time. 

 

The guest worker program was vehemently opposed by hard line Republicans. I believe that if a comprehensive immigration bill actually passed addressing the issue of illegal immigration; the Republicans would oppose it because it would deprive them of one of their best wedge issues. 

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