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Re: DeVos Lies For Profit

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Message 1 of 62

@rk9152 wrote:

@Olderscout66 wrote:

Vouchers do NOTHING except redistribute tax dollars from Public Schools to the pockets of the ones owning the for-profit. The amount given to the for-profit includes a reasonable amount of pay for the qualified teachers in the Public School system, but the FPs hire anybody with a pulse, pay them HALF of what qualified PS instructors get, and pocket the difference. Then the FPs drill the kids on the standard tests and for a year or two it looks like scores improve, but then the lack of the other basic knowledge the FP has no time to teach catches up and test scores drop back to what the PS is doing.

 

There is not a single case where student performance in the FP exceeded the PS after 5 years, by which time the owners of the FP are rich enough to close shop and move to their next willing victim represented by a Republican school board.

 

You want to improve education, give scholarships for college students willing to teach after graduation and repeal the Reagan taxscam so there's money to support and improve our public school facilities, just like our grandparents did for us.


If a School District is going to use a voucher system to improve the educational opportunities for some of their students it only makes sense that they would be selective as to the schools they approve. If not, that is poor performance on their part, not a basic flaw in the concept.

 

I recall in DC back quite a while they had a voucher system and the opponents were screaming and yelling that each vouchered kid removed $6,000 (the vouchered figure) per year from that school's budget. Yet, at the time the School District was paying out an average of $11, 000 per student per year. So, in effect, a school losing a student to the voucher system benefited by $5,000.

 


 If only pro-voucher advocates were not such obvious prejudiced in-the-closet bigots and racists whose attempts to fly under the radar aren't such poorly disguised attempts to bring back segregated schools...

 

As the Bleep-up-in-Chief often tweets - SAD...

 

 

He (tRump) is useless on top of the ground - he should be under it - inspiring the cabbages...
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Re: DeVos Lies For Profit

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Message 2 of 62

@Olderscout66 wrote:

Vouchers do NOTHING except redistribute tax dollars from Public Schools to the pockets of the ones owning the for-profit. The amount given to the for-profit includes a reasonable amount of pay for the qualified teachers in the Public School system, but the FPs hire anybody with a pulse, pay them HALF of what qualified PS instructors get, and pocket the difference. Then the FPs drill the kids on the standard tests and for a year or two it looks like scores improve, but then the lack of the other basic knowledge the FP has no time to teach catches up and test scores drop back to what the PS is doing.

 

There is not a single case where student performance in the FP exceeded the PS after 5 years, by which time the owners of the FP are rich enough to close shop and move to their next willing victim represented by a Republican school board.

 

You want to improve education, give scholarships for college students willing to teach after graduation and repeal the Reagan taxscam so there's money to support and improve our public school facilities, just like our grandparents did for us.


If a School District is going to use a voucher system to improve the educational opportunities for some of their students it only makes sense that they would be selective as to the schools they approve. If not, that is poor performance on their part, not a basic flaw in the concept.

 

I recall in DC back quite a while they had a voucher system and the opponents were screaming and yelling that each vouchered kid removed $6,000 (the vouchered figure) per year from that school's budget. Yet, at the time the School District was paying out an average of $11, 000 per student per year. So, in effect, a school losing a student to the voucher system benefited by $5,000.

 

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Re: DeVos Lies For Profit

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Message 3 of 62

Vouchers do NOTHING except redistribute tax dollars from Public Schools to the pockets of the ones owning the for-profit. The amount given to the for-profit includes a reasonable amount of pay for the qualified teachers in the Public School system, but the FPs hire anybody with a pulse, pay them HALF of what qualified PS instructors get, and pocket the difference. Then the FPs drill the kids on the standard tests and for a year or two it looks like scores improve, but then the lack of the other basic knowledge the FP has no time to teach catches up and test scores drop back to what the PS is doing.

 

There is not a single case where student performance in the FP exceeded the PS after 5 years, by which time the owners of the FP are rich enough to close shop and move to their next willing victim represented by a Republican school board.

 

You want to improve education, give scholarships for college students willing to teach after graduation and repeal the Reagan taxscam so there's money to support and improve our public school facilities, just like our grandparents did for us.

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Re: DeVos Lies For Profit

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Message 4 of 62

@MIseker wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@patriciah559514 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@Olderscout66 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:
Oh yeah..she is a Dominionist. People that want a Christian Theocracy ( her AND Pence ) and wants to fund for profit Christian schools ( her denomination of course) on the voucher system...as in using taxpayer money to fund religion.

How about the purpose is to make use of successful schools to give a better learning experience to kids in failing schools. Remember, no kid is assigned to a "voucher" school - their parents try to get them in. But there it is again - people should not make their own decisions, the government should make them for them.


with the end goal of putting public schools out of business. shift the taxes to a ceo and private school board, and get nothing in return.


Actually Mlseker, we'll get less than nothing because the for-profits do not require any teacher certification and beyond the first year, none show an actual improvement in student performance over the public schools the neoRepubs robbed to pay for them.

 

What the neoRepublicans will get is huge profits AND the ability to make sure no unsettling notions (like how Democracy should function) will be taught by the unqualified contract employees doing the actual teaching.


If the county puts out bids for road work heavy equipment companies compete and the result is the best product for the best price.

 

What is wrong with a similar approach being used by School Districts.

 

As always you are obsessing over someone making a (gasp!!) PROFIT.


hey..here is something to do!!! find out where the condition of Michigan roads rank in the US. used to be the state had the best roads in the country..until they laid off the road crew and went to lowest minimum bidder..kinda like..a charter school. 


Focus - we are talking about education. And the fact that a School District issues vouchers so that kids can go to schools approved by the District and requested by the parents should really lead to positive results.

 

Let's be honest - there are three thoughts behind the objections to Ms. DeVos:

1) She was nominated by President Trump;

2) To a limited extent, she could weaken the control over our educational systems that the unions have;

3) For some, she is rich and therefore to be hated.


"should" does not mean "has proven to" 

Study facts about education vs pontificating right wing fabrications


Besides such nit-picking, what is your real objection to "voucher" systems within our School Districts?


the topic? DeVos lies have been exposed. your turn to debunk the comment on the lies, not evade. But then that would be adult discussion wouldnt it?

No they haven't. Voucher systems have worked all over the country for years, DC used to have one. They get cancelled purely as sops to the unions.

 

What is it that you want me to debunk? And please don't play the "You go look it up" game. That would make you just one more "Yeah, me too".

 


 

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Re: DeVos Lies For Profit

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Message 5 of 62

@rk9152 wrote:

@patriciah559514 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@Olderscout66 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:
Oh yeah..she is a Dominionist. People that want a Christian Theocracy ( her AND Pence ) and wants to fund for profit Christian schools ( her denomination of course) on the voucher system...as in using taxpayer money to fund religion.

How about the purpose is to make use of successful schools to give a better learning experience to kids in failing schools. Remember, no kid is assigned to a "voucher" school - their parents try to get them in. But there it is again - people should not make their own decisions, the government should make them for them.


with the end goal of putting public schools out of business. shift the taxes to a ceo and private school board, and get nothing in return.


Actually Mlseker, we'll get less than nothing because the for-profits do not require any teacher certification and beyond the first year, none show an actual improvement in student performance over the public schools the neoRepubs robbed to pay for them.

 

What the neoRepublicans will get is huge profits AND the ability to make sure no unsettling notions (like how Democracy should function) will be taught by the unqualified contract employees doing the actual teaching.


If the county puts out bids for road work heavy equipment companies compete and the result is the best product for the best price.

 

What is wrong with a similar approach being used by School Districts.

 

As always you are obsessing over someone making a (gasp!!) PROFIT.


hey..here is something to do!!! find out where the condition of Michigan roads rank in the US. used to be the state had the best roads in the country..until they laid off the road crew and went to lowest minimum bidder..kinda like..a charter school. 


Focus - we are talking about education. And the fact that a School District issues vouchers so that kids can go to schools approved by the District and requested by the parents should really lead to positive results.

 

Let's be honest - there are three thoughts behind the objections to Ms. DeVos:

1) She was nominated by President Trump;

2) To a limited extent, she could weaken the control over our educational systems that the unions have;

3) For some, she is rich and therefore to be hated.


"should" does not mean "has proven to" 

Study facts about education vs pontificating right wing fabrications


Besides such nit-picking, what is your real objection to "voucher" systems within our School Districts?


the topic? DeVos lies have been exposed. your turn to debunk the comment on the lies, not evade. But then that would be adult discussion wouldnt it?

 

So it begins.
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Re: DeVos Lies For Profit

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Message 6 of 62

@rk9152 wrote:

@patriciah559514 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@Olderscout66 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:
Oh yeah..she is a Dominionist. People that want a Christian Theocracy ( her AND Pence ) and wants to fund for profit Christian schools ( her denomination of course) on the voucher system...as in using taxpayer money to fund religion.

How about the purpose is to make use of successful schools to give a better learning experience to kids in failing schools. Remember, no kid is assigned to a "voucher" school - their parents try to get them in. But there it is again - people should not make their own decisions, the government should make them for them.


with the end goal of putting public schools out of business. shift the taxes to a ceo and private school board, and get nothing in return.


Actually Mlseker, we'll get less than nothing because the for-profits do not require any teacher certification and beyond the first year, none show an actual improvement in student performance over the public schools the neoRepubs robbed to pay for them.

 

What the neoRepublicans will get is huge profits AND the ability to make sure no unsettling notions (like how Democracy should function) will be taught by the unqualified contract employees doing the actual teaching.


If the county puts out bids for road work heavy equipment companies compete and the result is the best product for the best price.

 

What is wrong with a similar approach being used by School Districts.

 

As always you are obsessing over someone making a (gasp!!) PROFIT.


hey..here is something to do!!! find out where the condition of Michigan roads rank in the US. used to be the state had the best roads in the country..until they laid off the road crew and went to lowest minimum bidder..kinda like..a charter school. 


Focus - we are talking about education. And the fact that a School District issues vouchers so that kids can go to schools approved by the District and requested by the parents should really lead to positive results.

 

Let's be honest - there are three thoughts behind the objections to Ms. DeVos:

1) She was nominated by President Trump;

2) To a limited extent, she could weaken the control over our educational systems that the unions have;

3) For some, she is rich and therefore to be hated.


"should" does not mean "has proven to" 

Study facts about education vs pontificating right wing fabrications


Besides such nit-picking, what is your real objection to "voucher" systems within our School Districts?


Only that the voucher concept arose from racist/segregationists and has been picked up by dominionists - all of whom suck.

 

Oh yes - there's never been any question - they lie every bit as much as trump and his conservative/republican supporters/followers do...

 

 

He (tRump) is useless on top of the ground - he should be under it - inspiring the cabbages...
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Re: DeVos Lies For Profit

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Message 7 of 62

@patriciah559514 wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@Olderscout66 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:
Oh yeah..she is a Dominionist. People that want a Christian Theocracy ( her AND Pence ) and wants to fund for profit Christian schools ( her denomination of course) on the voucher system...as in using taxpayer money to fund religion.

How about the purpose is to make use of successful schools to give a better learning experience to kids in failing schools. Remember, no kid is assigned to a "voucher" school - their parents try to get them in. But there it is again - people should not make their own decisions, the government should make them for them.


with the end goal of putting public schools out of business. shift the taxes to a ceo and private school board, and get nothing in return.


Actually Mlseker, we'll get less than nothing because the for-profits do not require any teacher certification and beyond the first year, none show an actual improvement in student performance over the public schools the neoRepubs robbed to pay for them.

 

What the neoRepublicans will get is huge profits AND the ability to make sure no unsettling notions (like how Democracy should function) will be taught by the unqualified contract employees doing the actual teaching.


If the county puts out bids for road work heavy equipment companies compete and the result is the best product for the best price.

 

What is wrong with a similar approach being used by School Districts.

 

As always you are obsessing over someone making a (gasp!!) PROFIT.


hey..here is something to do!!! find out where the condition of Michigan roads rank in the US. used to be the state had the best roads in the country..until they laid off the road crew and went to lowest minimum bidder..kinda like..a charter school. 


Focus - we are talking about education. And the fact that a School District issues vouchers so that kids can go to schools approved by the District and requested by the parents should really lead to positive results.

 

Let's be honest - there are three thoughts behind the objections to Ms. DeVos:

1) She was nominated by President Trump;

2) To a limited extent, she could weaken the control over our educational systems that the unions have;

3) For some, she is rich and therefore to be hated.


"should" does not mean "has proven to" 

Study facts about education vs pontificating right wing fabrications


Besides such nit-picking, what is your real objection to "voucher" systems within our School Districts?

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Re: DeVos Lies For Profit

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Message 8 of 62

@Olderscout66 wrote:

Construction projects go to the LOWEST BIDDER, and come with a surety clause that holds the winner liable if they fail to complete the work as agreed.

 

DeVos encourages the use of no-bid contracts going to whoever the local Republican hacks are related to and there certainly has never been a for-profit held accountable by the State for non-compliance. Instead we get virtually every non-profit college getting sued by individual students who were defrauded, a la' Trump University who got off with only $25 Million in restitution to over 6,000 of "his" students who were bilked out of over $40M by his fake education.

 

Now that disgusting fraudster has the opportunity to do to students k-12 what he did to kids wanting a college education, and DeVos is making it happen.

 

thanks again Hillary Haters


Is your objection to taking control of education partially out of the hands of the unions or the bidding process? 

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Re: DeVos Lies For Profit

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Message 9 of 62

@MIseker wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@Olderscout66 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:

@rk9152 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:
Oh yeah..she is a Dominionist. People that want a Christian Theocracy ( her AND Pence ) and wants to fund for profit Christian schools ( her denomination of course) on the voucher system...as in using taxpayer money to fund religion.

How about the purpose is to make use of successful schools to give a better learning experience to kids in failing schools. Remember, no kid is assigned to a "voucher" school - their parents try to get them in. But there it is again - people should not make their own decisions, the government should make them for them.


with the end goal of putting public schools out of business. shift the taxes to a ceo and private school board, and get nothing in return.


Actually Mlseker, we'll get less than nothing because the for-profits do not require any teacher certification and beyond the first year, none show an actual improvement in student performance over the public schools the neoRepubs robbed to pay for them.

 

What the neoRepublicans will get is huge profits AND the ability to make sure no unsettling notions (like how Democracy should function) will be taught by the unqualified contract employees doing the actual teaching.


If the county puts out bids for road work heavy equipment companies compete and the result is the best product for the best price.

 

What is wrong with a similar approach being used by School Districts.

 

As always you are obsessing over someone making a (gasp!!) PROFIT.


hey..here is something to do!!! find out where the condition of Michigan roads rank in the US. used to be the state had the best roads in the country..until they laid off the road crew and went to lowest minimum bidder..kinda like..a charter school. 


Focus - we are talking about education. And the fact that a School District issues vouchers so that kids can go to schools approved by the District and requested by the parents should really lead to positive results.

 

Let's be honest - there are three thoughts behind the objections to Ms. DeVos:

1) She was nominated by President Trump;

2) To a limited extent, she could weaken the control over our educational systems that the unions have;

3) For some, she is rich and therefore to be hated.


Focus. the topic is devos lies for profit. >>>

If the county puts out bids for road work heavy equipment companies compete and the result is the best product for the best price.

 hypocrit much? i mean..its all in the same post.


?????????????????????

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Re: DeVos Lies For Profit

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Message 10 of 62

@Olderscout66 wrote:


Exactly what the neoRepublicans intend - that we have to educate our own children about how Democracy works because the for-profits they replace public education with certainly won't teach anything so "controversial" as American Government or Civics.

 

One of the first things Hitler took over were the schools, after which he replaced Boy Scouts with Hitler Junge to make sure the children only learned what he wanted them to know. neoRepublicans consider Der Fuhrer's "reform" of education highly instructive and are working to establish a very similar "reform" of American education under Der Trumper.

 

An interesting analogy when you consider the fact that the major objection to DeVos is her desires to bring more private schools into the overall education system. In other words to wrest control out of the hands of the fascist-like system of control by the Government and the Unions. That is like the "syndicates" established by Mussolini.

 

The current system  does in fact place control as to what the children will be told - even taking it from the parents - in the hands of the government. There was someone before your often mentioned Hitler to come up with that idea - your man Marx.


 

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