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Re: Custom Wedding Cake Legal Battle Continues

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Message 141 of 156

@john258 wrote:

 

There is  a simple answer here. People just stop buying from the store, and it goes out of business.


I have to agree with that sentence.  Isn't that how the 'American way' should be?  Let consumers decide if the owner is right in cases like this instead of the law and courts?  It's call free enterprise, and that is what made this country great.  And isn't that what started our Revolutionary War....restrictive laws governing business?

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Re: Custom Wedding Cake Legal Battle Continues

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Message 142 of 156

@Richva wrote:



I have yet to determine how religious beliefs come into this.


Of course when one can't respect that there are some who take their religous beliefs seriously, especially those with a deep faith in New Testament teachings.

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Re: Custom Wedding Cake Legal Battle Continues

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Message 143 of 156

@Loulit wrote:

@phyllisc6781 wrote:

@Loulit wrote:

What if it was just someone he didn't like. Say a person whose kid had beaten up his kid at school. Could he say, "No, I'm not baking for you. Get the h** l out of my store."  I would hope he could.

 

In the case of the same-sex couple the problem is one that pits the rights of the individual's religious freedom and freedom of speech, against the rights of a group which cannot be legally discriminated against.

 

The baker contends that a custom wedding cake celebrating a gay marriage is a work of art. The government cannot force a painter to paint, a singer to sing, a sculptor to sculpt.  If a gay couple wants a wedding band and that band does not want to perform for a same sex marriage reception, can the government make them take the stage? I sure hope not.

 

I'm for gay marriage. I'm for gay couples adopting kids. Gay married couples are entitled to all the rights an employer grants to straight couples, such as the spouse of the employee being covered by company health insurance.

 

But if the business owner finds himself morally unable to create for something his religion forbids, he should be able to say no. It's his business, his store. Maybe the best thing for the gay couple to do is walk down the street to the next bakery. If the gay couple want to protest and boycott the bakery that wouldn't serve them, they can. 

 

I usually come down on the side of the individual. In this case, the baker; a small business owner trying to stand up for what he believes. I think what he believes is ignorant and wrong -- but I wouldn't take away his right to believe it. The ACLU is representing the gay couple. I was a big fan of the ACLU until United Citizens v. Federal Elections Commission. They picked the wrong side on that one and I cancelled my membership. I was steamin'. I think the ACLU is on the wrong side again.

 

 


This is not a simple your kid hit mine. This is discrimination. This is a business owner who chose to ignore the laws against discrimination. If the owners are open for business, they are open for business to everyone. Good for ACLU! Very bad ruling on part of judge who over turned original order. A review of non-discrimination statutes might be in order. 

It is people like these bakers who make me wonder what the heck is wrong with people. I own a small business myself, and not only would I never decide non-discrimination laws didn’t apply to me, I would never be so disgustingly narcissistic or ignorant as to think I shouldn’t cater to someone due to  their choice of a mate. 

I liked the idea of the poster who said people should boycott the business until the bigoted and ignorant owners go out of business. 

 

Gee, I miss having a real president!


The gay couple has the law on their side and will most likely win the case. Then we'll live in a country where the government can tell a business owner to betray his religous principles or close his doors.

 

Great.


If you believe that God created man, you know God created gays—(1 in every ten people are born homosexual—look it up), so in what REAL religion is it ok to turn one's back on God’s creations?

 Using religion as an excuse to be a bigot is no more than an easy out to discriminate against that which is not understood.

Another tidbot of info.—homosexuality is found in all species—did God make a huge mistake? Remember that the Bible was written by man, given free will by God. When the majority of people are heterosexual, of course homosexual behavior as seen as “strange,” and, of course, that is how it was interpreted by the men—NOT GOD—who wrote the Book.

But,  there was no science, nothing available to help them understand that this is a common—and natural occurrence.

 

 Using religion as an excuse to be ignorant and bigoted is actually something I think would cause God great pain. Religion is no excuse to condemn others for something that happens frequently in nature. God made no mistake.

 

And again,  if you are in a business open to the public,  you serve the public. If you want to practice your religion, go to church. If you can’t do both, go find another occupation. 

 

Gee, I miss having a real president!

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Re: Custom Wedding Cake Legal Battle Continues

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Message 144 of 156

@phyllisc6781 wrote:

@Loulit wrote:

What if it was just someone he didn't like. Say a person whose kid had beaten up his kid at school. Could he say, "No, I'm not baking for you. Get the h** l out of my store."  I would hope he could.

 

In the case of the same-sex couple the problem is one that pits the rights of the individual's religious freedom and freedom of speech, against the rights of a group which cannot be legally discriminated against.

 

The baker contends that a custom wedding cake celebrating a gay marriage is a work of art. The government cannot force a painter to paint, a singer to sing, a sculptor to sculpt.  If a gay couple wants a wedding band and that band does not want to perform for a same sex marriage reception, can the government make them take the stage? I sure hope not.

 

I'm for gay marriage. I'm for gay couples adopting kids. Gay married couples are entitled to all the rights an employer grants to straight couples, such as the spouse of the employee being covered by company health insurance.

 

But if the business owner finds himself morally unable to create for something his religion forbids, he should be able to say no. It's his business, his store. Maybe the best thing for the gay couple to do is walk down the street to the next bakery. If the gay couple want to protest and boycott the bakery that wouldn't serve them, they can. 

 

I usually come down on the side of the individual. In this case, the baker; a small business owner trying to stand up for what he believes. I think what he believes is ignorant and wrong -- but I wouldn't take away his right to believe it. The ACLU is representing the gay couple. I was a big fan of the ACLU until United Citizens v. Federal Elections Commission. They picked the wrong side on that one and I cancelled my membership. I was steamin'. I think the ACLU is on the wrong side again.

 

 


This is not a simple your kid hit mine. This is discrimination. This is a business owner who chose to ignore the laws against discrimination. If the owners are open for business, they are open for business to everyone. Good for ACLU! Very bad ruling on part of judge who over turned original order. A review of non-discrimination statutes might be in order. 

It is people like these bakers who make me wonder what the heck is wrong with people. I own a small business myself, and not only would I never decide non-discrimination laws didn’t apply to me, I would never be so disgustingly narcissistic or ignorant as to think I shouldn’t cater to someone due to  their choice of a mate. 

I liked the idea of the poster who said people should boycott the business until the bigoted and ignorant owners go out of business. 

 

Gee, I miss having a real president!


The gay couple has the law on their side and will most likely win the case. Then we'll live in a country where the government can tell a business owner to betray his religous principles or close his doors.

 

Great.

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Re: Custom Wedding Cake Legal Battle Continues

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Message 145 of 156

@Loulit wrote:

What if it was just someone he didn't like. Say a person whose kid had beaten up his kid at school. Could he say, "No, I'm not baking for you. Get the h** l out of my store."  I would hope he could.

 


This is not a simple your kid hit mine. This is discrimination. This is a business owner who chose to ignore the laws against discrimination. If the owners are open for business, they are open for business to everyone. Good for ACLU! Very bad ruling on part of judge who over turned original order. A review of non-discrimination statutes might be in order. 

It is people like these bakers who make me wonder what the heck is wrong with people. I own a small business myself, and not only would I never decide non-discrimination laws didn’t apply to me, I would never be so disgustingly narcissistic or ignorant as to think I shouldn’t cater to someone due to  their choice of a mate. 

I liked the idea of the poster who said people should boycott the business until the bigoted and ignorant owners go out of business. 

 

Gee, I miss having a real president!

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Re: Custom Wedding Cake Legal Battle Continues

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Message 146 of 156

What if it was just someone he didn't like. Say a person whose kid had beaten up his kid at school. Could he say, "No, I'm not baking for you. Get the h** l out of my store."  I would hope he could.

 

In the case of the same-sex couple the problem is one that pits the rights of the individual's religious freedom and freedom of speech, against the rights of a group which cannot be legally discriminated against.

 

The baker contends that a custom wedding cake celebrating a gay marriage is a work of art. The government cannot force a painter to paint, a singer to sing, a sculptor to sculpt.  If a gay couple wants a wedding band and that band does not want to perform for a same sex marriage reception, can the government make them take the stage? I sure hope not.

 

I'm for gay marriage. I'm for gay couples adopting kids. Gay married couples are entitled to all the rights an employer grants to straight couples, such as the spouse of the employee being covered by company health insurance.

 

But if the business owner finds himself morally unable to create for something his religion forbids, he should be able to say no. It's his business, his store. Maybe the best thing for the gay couple to do is walk down the street to the next bakery. If the gay couple want to protest and boycott the bakery that wouldn't serve them, they can. 

 

I usually come down on the side of the individual. In this case, the baker; a small business owner trying to stand up for what he believes. I think what he believes is ignorant and wrong -- but I wouldn't take away his right to believe it. The ACLU is representing the gay couple. I was a big fan of the ACLU until United Citizens v. Federal Elections Commission. They picked the wrong side on that one and I cancelled my membership. I was steamin'. I think the ACLU is on the wrong side again.

 

 

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Re: Custom Wedding Cake Legal Battle Continues

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Message 147 of 156

There is  a simple answer here. People just stop buying from the store, and it goes out of business. This has happened in quite a few other places so lets hope it happens here.

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Re: Custom Wedding Cake Legal Battle Continues

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Message 148 of 156

@TxGrandpa2 wrote:

@MIseker wrote:


 

yes, and hateful posters lol.

 


So it's admitted that anyone who ventures a different opinion than yours is 'hateful'?

 

Not sorry for not marching in lockstep with the 'approved' opinion.  This is a forum for discussion of various views isn't it?

 

Of course no doubt that the liberal view is that some are more equal than others, and they are made equal by taking away the rights of others.  Who cares if it destroys the hard work of a person who has built up a business. 


No but the ones who twist words tend to be hateful.  Just a rule of thumb. 

 

"Approved opinion"?  Kind of like not being for slavery is an approved opinion? Not being for segregation and unequal rights is an approved opinion?  Seems logical to me. 

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Re: Custom Wedding Cake Legal Battle Continues

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Message 149 of 156

@GailL1 wrote:

A California county superior court judge has ruled in favor of an anti-gay Christian baker who refused to sell a same-sex couple a custom wedding cake, citing her religious beliefs. Last August Cathy Miller, the owner of Tastries bakery told a couple she would not bake them a cake and referred them to another baker.

 

. . . . . In December Judge Lampe refused to grant California a temporary restraining order barring Miller from selling any item to a different-sex couple she would not sell to a same-sex couple.

 

"The difference here is that the cake is not yet baked," Judge Lampe wrote in his decision Monday. "The state is not petitioning the court to order defendants to sell a cake. The state asks this court to compel Miller to use her talents to design and create a cake she has not yet conceived with the knowledge that her work will be displayed in celebration of a marital union her religion forbids. For this court to force such compliance would do violence to the essentials of Free Speech guaranteed under the First Amendment."

 

New Civil Rights Movement - Pre-Made Wedding Cakes vs Custom Cakes for Same Sex Couple Couples

 

read more at the link -

 

Guess the SCOTUS needs to hurry with their decision - expected in June.


 Yes, SCOTUS will have to decide this, since it’s clear that this judge has forgotten what civil rights and equality is all about. 

 

Gee, I miss having a real president!

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Re: Custom Wedding Cake Legal Battle Continues

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Message 150 of 156

@MIseker wrote:


 

yes, and hateful posters lol.

 


So it's admitted that anyone who ventures a different opinion than yours is 'hateful'?

 

Not sorry for not marching in lockstep with the 'approved' opinion.  This is a forum for discussion of various views isn't it?

 

Of course no doubt that the liberal view is that some are more equal than others, and they are made equal by taking away the rights of others.  Who cares if it destroys the hard work of a person who has built up a business. 

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