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Valued Social Butterfly

Re: 109 Killed by Police Already in 2018 - Looks Like it's Going to be a Long Yr.

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Message 21 of 62

TxGrandpa2 wrote:

 

Even the database maintained by the Washington Post reflects only totals but doesn't break it down to whether the victim was armed, unarmed, or whether engaged in a crime.  Without this infomation the total is just that.


It most certainly does "break it down" to whether they were armed, unarmed, what they were armed with, a most everything that you have questioned.

 

Either you haven't tried really looking at the data base or for some reason have failed to figure out how to navigate such a simple to use website/data base.


"The only thing man learns from history is man learns nothing from history"
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Re: 123 Killed by Police Already in 2018 - It's Going to be a Long Yr.

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Message 22 of 62

rk9152 wrote:

Centristsin2010 wrote:

rk9152 wrote:



Guess who brought up "the other" topic. I'd say the person who posted, "Or Sheriffs claiming they love killing people over damaging a squad car to cite another". Although, that may no really be "off topic" - its all about hating cops.

 

Now back to the issue of "honor" are you going to show where the data offered says that the Sheriff said that he loved killing people - or is the 'scuse me enroute?

 

Again....TROLLING.  Maybe you should go back to the other topic and whine there....

 

Meanwhile, the number killed by law enforcement has reached 123 including 9 that were unarmed, 2 with toy guns and countless others that were unnecessary.


 As I suspected, you are unable to defend your fraud topic which you interjected into this one.

 

Hiding behind "TROLLING" simply does not hack it.


 


Got anythng to post in reference to the 9 unarmed that were killed? Now go ahead, call me a "cop hater" for asking that.


"The only thing man learns from history is man learns nothing from history"
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Re: 109 Killed by Police Already in 2018 - Looks Like it's Going to be a Long Yr.

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Message 23 of 62

TxGrandpa2 wrote:

Centristsin2010 wrote:


I do know that 30 years ago, many of those in our generation heard of someone being killed by the police, heard the police say it was justified, and took that as fact.  .

I'm not sure of what you mean about 'our generation', but I do recall from a discussion of ours some years ago on this forum it seems that yours is more of a younger generation than mine.  So?  You may figure it out some time....

 

But over the years I don't recall a lot of dialogue nor reports about killings by police being justified or not justified.  Of course not, that's the point.  We were told that they all were justified.

 

Fact is I don't recall that many killings by law enforcement until your mentioning them here, of course not and again, that's the point. ost had their heads in the sand while the FBI was under-reporting the killings and claiming all victims were "felons"   and most of those are from all over the country rather than localized. And your point is what? This is a huge country and in proportion to the entire country of hundreds of millions the number is minuscue, not discounting the value of a human life.  Actually, you ARE discounting the value of a human life.  How many are unnecessary killings are exceptable to you?

 

Even at that, a database is just that and has no value unless put into perspective.  That isn't being done here but is being used for sensational purposes. Of course, that's just your opinion.  Many see it for what it is, useful data for folks to assess on their own, to do their own research and get smarter. How many of those killed were unarmed?  Ten so far this year.  But those who are identified as having a gun, doesn't mean they were shooting at anyone.  Phillip Castille had a gun, and a license to carry one.  A panicky cop shot him dead when he reached for his drivers license.  Had a gun, wasn't threatening a cop or anyone else; wasn't brandishing it yet still shot dead in cold blood.  

 

Even the database maintained by the Washington Post reflects only totals but doesn't break it down to whether the victim was armed, yes it does....apparently you choose not to understand the data base....unarmed,  again, yes it does....apparently you choose not to understand the data base....three years now you've been whining about the database and STILL don't know how it works.  It's a hoot when someone whines about something and are clueless about what they are whining about.....it happens alot with many on the right..... or whether engaged in a crime. The information is there for you to get all the information your heart desires.... Without this infomation the total is just that.  And since the information is there and exists, your conclusion is bogus.

 

Thanks for playing along....


"FAKE 45 #illegitimate" read a sign at the Woman's March in Washington DC, January 21, 2017.
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Re: 123 Killed by Police Already in 2018 - Looks Like it's Going to be a Long Yr.

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Message 24 of 62

Olderscout66 wrote:

All those mandatory things for cops would be much less necessary IF we had a mandatory 10-year, no parole no concurrent sentencing for each crime committed while carrying a gun and 5 years for whoever sold the perp his piece.


I would agree with your solution, though it still doesn't address many of the issues with poor police work.


"FAKE 45 #illegitimate" read a sign at the Woman's March in Washington DC, January 21, 2017.
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Re: 123 Killed by Police Already in 2018 - Looks Like it's Going to be a Long Yr.

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Message 25 of 62

Olderscout66 wrote:

All those mandatory things for cops would be much less necessary IF we had a mandatory 10-year, no parole no concurrent sentencing for each crime committed while carrying a gun and 5 years for whoever sold the perp his piece.


There already is extra penalties for using a gun in committing a crime.  Apparently no deterrence.

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Re: 123 Killed by Police Already in 2018 - Looks Like it's Going to be a Long Yr.

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Message 26 of 62

All those mandatory things for cops would be much less necessary IF we had a mandatory 10-year, no parole no concurrent sentencing for each crime committed while carrying a gun and 5 years for whoever sold the perp his piece.

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Re: 123 Killed by Police Already in 2018 - Looks Like it's Going to be a Long Yr.

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Message 27 of 62

mandm84 wrote:

  I feel it's our duty to address the unjustified killings , but do we know how many of the 123 are actually unjustified ?


I would believe that failure to address as to how many of these totals were unjustified is doing an injustice to those honest cops out there.  I have to note that this question is dismissed when asked. If someone is going to post a database like this there is no reason not to put it into perspective.  As it is, it is apparent that the poster is using it to denigrate all law enforcement.

 

 

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Re: 109 Killed by Police Already in 2018 - Looks Like it's Going to be a Long Yr.

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Message 28 of 62

Centristsin2010 wrote:


I do know that 30 years ago, many of those in our generation heard of someone being killed by the police, heard the police say it was justified, and took that as fact.  .

I'm not sure of what you mean about 'our generation', but I do recall from a discussion of ours some years ago on this forum it seems that yours is more of a younger generation than mine.  But over the years I don't recall a lot of dialogue nor reports about killings by police being justified or not justified.  

 

Fact is I don't recall that many killings by law enforcement until your mentioning them here, and most of those are from all over the country rather than localized.  This is a huge country and in proportion to the entire country of hundreds of millions the number is minuscue, not discounting the value of a human life.

 

Even at that, a database is just that and has no value unless put into perspective.  That isn't being done here but is being used for sensational purposes.  How many of those killed were unarmed?  And what percentage of the whole was that?

 

Even the database maintained by the Washington Post reflects only totals but doesn't break it down to whether the victim was armed, unarmed, or whether engaged in a crime.  Without this infomation the total is just that.

 

 

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Re: 123 Killed by Police Already in 2018 - Looks Like it's Going to be a Long Yr.

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Message 29 of 62
@mandm84 wrote:

  Cent , we are in agreement that there are a few bad Police Officers out there and when they violate their Code of Ethics and our Laws , they should be held accountable , Cool.  Lets focus on more agreement as well....

 

but you are talking about such a small minority of Police Officers out there.  I hope you are right, but I don't like "hoping" a problem goes away and may I assume you don't as well?

 

What I'm "talking about" is this....

 

1.  There are bad cops out there, which we agree on.  But let's agree on the definition first, shall we?  I'll throw this out there and let's see if we have more "common ground".  Bad cops are those who are racist (see Inkster, MI for example), don't follow police procedures ( see Chaleston, SC), or are just poorly trained (Minneapolis, MN), the Sheriff in Tennessee who boasted he loves killing motorists, or whatever he "loved" after ordering his Deputy's to shoot and kill an unarmed man and father of two.  Are we in agreement so far?  We can modify that as desired.....

 

2.  There are negligent and/or reckless cops, those who shoot and claim they saw or thought a suspect had a gun when it's determined no gun existed.  This would include the cop who shot and killed the guy reaching to turn down his iPhone and the SWAT member who shot and killed the father of two in his front door, whose only crime was playing video games.  Would you agree?

 

3.  Cops who know of of 1 and 2 and do nothing about them, don't report it to superiors, don't document evidence, etc.  AND/or, file false reports or make false statements to cover for 1 and 2.  Are we on the same page?

 

Then we need possible solutions:

 

1.  Mandatory body camera's with significant fines if turned off during contact with the public;

 

2   Mandatory dash-board camers with significant fines for any manipulation of the footage or camera

 

3   Mandatory training addressing those with mental illness or other disabilities and de-esculating difficult situations;

 

4.  Mandatory use of the disability notification app.

 

5.  In cases where the officers life or anothers life is not in immediate danger, tasers will be first option;

 

Are those fair expectations to you?

 

We are afterall dealing with human beings , who are under extreme circumstances , who make mistakes and I agree should be held accountable.  Super.

 

We will never have perfection with 1 Million Law Enforcement Officers engaged in a very dangerous and unpredictable line of work.  Im not making excuses , but explaining the harsh realities of such a difficult career.  Well, with all due respect, I think you are making excuses, BUT, it is a challenging career as you say.  A career they chose, a career where they are respected by most, a career where there is a good salary, an opportunity to have a powerful positive impact in a community, excellent advancement opportunities, make significant par-time dollars based on the paid training received and the experience, as well as being killed in a second.

 

There has been tremendous advancements in recruitment and ongoing training.  I agree.

 

I responded to your post because you mentioned 123 killed by Police , but how many shootings are justified ?  Do you know?  I don't.  The one in Wichita obviously wasn't.  Ten were killed and had no weapon at all.  It's not fair to just list 123 and attack all of the Police Officers involved.  No one has attacked "all of the police" as you claim.  That's just wrong!  And, I think malicious.  Did you read the very first post within the topic?  Much of it is covered here as well.  But why create an issue that doesn't exist?  No one is attacking ALL the police.

 

I feel it's our duty to address the unjustified killings , I agree!  So what do you do as part of your duty?  

 

but do we know how many of the 123 are actually unjustified ?  Nope.  The data is there for anyone to search on each and every case though.

 

Do you think it was intentional that the FBI under-reported police killings for years?


 


"FAKE 45 #illegitimate" read a sign at the Woman's March in Washington DC, January 21, 2017.
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Re: 123 Killed by Police Already in 2018 - Looks Like it's Going to be a Long Yr.

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Message 30 of 62

  Cent , we are in agreement that there are a few bad Police Officers out there and when they violate their Code of Ethics and our Laws , they should be held accountable , but you are talking about such a small minority of Police Officers out there.

  We are afterall dealing with human beings , who are under extreme circumstances , who make mistakes and I agree should be held accountable.     We will never have perfection with 1 Million Law Enforcement Officers engaged in a very dangerous and unpredictable line of work.  Im not making excuses , but explaining the harsh realities of such a difficult career.There has been tremendous advancements in recruitment and ongoing training. 

  I responded to your post because you mentioned 123 killed by Police , but how many shootings are justified ? It's not fair to just list 123 and attack all of the Police Officers involved.

  I feel it's our duty to address the unjustified killings , but do we know how many of the 123 are actually unjustified ?

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