Regular Contributor

Re: Another un-answer to my questions

Message 681 of 1,450
Dr. Osmunson, are we clear that you believe community water fluoridation is the ethical equivalent of the Tuskegee Syphilis study?
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Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

Message 682 of 1,450

In many cases higher courts have made improper decisions while lower courts decided more carefully. Even the Supreme Court has made decisions that contradicted earlier Supreme Court decisions. As for fluoridation, ingested fluoride does alter the chemistry of the human body while not even being able ironically to penetrate into the teeth enamel matrix. There is no court ruling one way or appeal another way that changes this. Fluoridaiotn is a useless harmful cause.

Richard Sauerheber, Ph.D.
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Regular Contributor

Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

Message 683 of 1,450
Actually this is not the case. Cases which are overturned on appeal are not "very successful." No case has survived the scrutiny of appeal. It is no surprise that lower court make mistakes, The purpose of appeal courts is to correct errors.

The courtroom is not the place to "decide" complex science. Systematic reviews where experts for the panel are selected for a spectrum of important scientific skills and there is ample budget to collect and consider all the scientific literature is the appropriate forum.
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Bronze Conversationalist

Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

Message 684 of 1,450

We are going around in circles. Water additives have already been discussed. All water additives that are legalas described in the SDWA are those that actually purify water (remove debris, prevent corrosion, and sanitize water, etc.). But the one substance that is not a legal additive is fluoride. Fluoride is the only chemical added into water for the purpose of treating humans. It does not purify water.  The NSF labels fluosilicic acid hazardous waste as a water purifying agent pass inspection and to gain favor with skeptics so that it appears legal to add into water. Fluoride has zero ability to purify water. It is added to elevate the blood concentration of the non-nutrient contaminant fluoride ion in consumers.

Richard Sauerheber, Ph.D.
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Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

Message 685 of 1,450

When I hear fluoridationists using opponents language, I'm reminded of the classic comic-strip villian scenario where the super-villian assumes the likeness of the hero in order to confuse the public.


Fluoridationist arguments are all logical fallacies and worse. For example: 

Numerical DeceitNumerical Deceit

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Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

Message 686 of 1,450
AARP must choose whether to believe the many systematic reviews as well as about 150 prestigious organizations and groups who advocate for fluoridation as important, safe and effective in preventing Cavities. Here's the list from the Quebec National Institute of Public health (alphabetic as long as the allowed post). p 47

Academy of Dentistry International
Academy of General Dentistry
Academy for Sports Dentistry
Alzheimer's Association
America's Health Insurance Plans
American Academy of Family Physicians
American Academy of Nurse Practitioners
American Academy of Oral and Maxillofacial Pathology
American Academy of Orthopaedic Surgeons
American Academy of Pediatrics
American Academy of Pediatrie Dentistry
American Academy of Periodontology
American Academy of Physician Assistants
American Association for Community Dental Programs
American Association for Dental Research
American Association for Health Education
American Association for the Advancement of Science
Water Fluoridation: An Analysis of the Health Benefits and Risks
Institut national de santé publique du Québec 37
American Association of Endodontists
American Association of Oral and Maxillofacial Surgeons
American Association of Orthodontists
American Association of Public Health Dentistry
American Association of Women Dentists
American Cancer Society
American College of Dentists
American College of Physicians-American Society of Internal Medicine
American College of Preventive Medicine
American College of Prosthodontists
American Council on Science and Health
American Dental Assistants Association
American Dental Association
American Dental Education Association
American Dental Hygienists' Association
American Dietetic Association
American Federation of Labor and Congress of Industrial Organizations
American Hospital Association
American Institute of Nutrition
American Legislative Exchange Council
American Medical Association
American Nurses Association
American Osteopathic Association
American Pharmaceutical Association
American Pharmacists Association
American Public Health Association
American School Health Association
American Society for Clinical Nutrition
American Society for Nutritional Sciences
American Student Dental Association
American Veterinary Medical Association
American Water Works Association
Water Fluoridation: An Analysis of the Health Benefits and Risks
38 Institut national de santé publique du Québec
Association for Academic Health Centers
Association of American Medical Colleges
Association of Clinicians for the Underserved
Association of Maternal and Child Health Programs
Association of State and Territorial Dental Directors
Association of State and Territorial Health Officials
Association of State and Territorial Public Health
Australian National Health and Medical Research Council NHMRC
Australian Dental Association ADA
Australian Health Ministers' Conference
Australia New South Wales Department of Health
Nutrition Directors
British Dental Association
British Fluoridation Society
British Medical Association
Center for Science in the Public Interest
Child Welfare League of America
Consumer Federation of America
Children's Dental Health Project
Consumer Federation of America
Council of State and Territorial Epidemiologists
Delta Dental Plans Association
European Organization for Caries Research
Fédération Dentaire Internationale FDI
Federation of American Hospitals
Food and Nutrition Board
Great Britain Ministry of Health
Health Insurance Association of America
Hispanic Dental Association
Indian Dental Association U.S.A.
Institute of Medicine
International Association for Dental Research
Water Fluoridation: An Analysis of the Health Benefits and Risks
Institut national de santé publique du Québec 39
International Association for Orthodontics
International College of Dentists
March of Dimes Birth Defects Foundation
Mayo Clinic
National Academy of Science
National Association of Community Health Centers
National Association of County and City Health Officials
National Association of Dental Assistants
National Association of Local Boards of Health
National Association of Social Workers
National Cancer Institute
National Confectioners Association
National Council Against Health Fraud
National Dental Assistants Association
National Dental Association
National Dental Hygienists' Association
National Down Syndrome Congress
National Down Syndrome Society
National Eating Disorders Association
National Foundation of Dentistry for the Handicapped
National Health Council
National Head Start Association
National Health Law Program
National Healthy Mothers, Healthy Babies Coalition
New Zealand Ministry of Health
Oral Health America
Pan American Health Organization
Public Health Association of Australia
Robert Wood Johnson Foundation
Royal College of Physicians London
Society for Public Health Education
Society of American Indian Dentists
Special Care Dentistry
The Children's Health Fund
The Dental Health Foundation of California
U.S. Department of Defense
U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs
U.S. Public Health Service
U.S. Surgeon General
Health Resources and Services Administration HRSA
Centers for Disease Control and Prevention CDC
Food and Drug Administration FDA
Indian Health Service
Health Resources and Services Administration HRSA
National Institute of Dental and Craniofacial Research NIDCR
World Federation of Orthodontists
World Health Organization
Quebec Order of dentists
Quebec order of dental hygienists
Quebec college of physicians
Québec Association of Pediatricians
Quebec order of pharmacists
Quebec Federation of family physicians
Coalition Of Physicians for Social Justice
McGill University Faculty of Dentistry
Montreal Public Health Department
Quebec association of public health dentists
Montreal Children’s Hospital Council of Community Pediatricians
Montreal Children’ Hospital Child Development Program
Quebec dental academy
St-Justine Hospital department of pediatics
St-Justine Hospital university center
Table de concertation des hygienistes dentaires en sante communautaire des régions
Montreal, Laval, Laurentides et Lanaudiere
Montreal Research Centre on Social Inequalities in Health
University of Montreal department of social and preventive medicine
Dental association for disabled people
Quebec department of health and social services
Quebec department of environment
Canadian Association of Dental Public Health
Canadian Dental Association
Canadian Dental Hygienist Association
Canadian Medical Association
Canadian Nurses Association
Canadian Pediatric Society
Canadian Public Health Association
Health Canada
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Bronze Conversationalist

Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

Message 687 of 1,450

And why not tell the more complete story? It is hoped that AARP staff and all readers understand that there have been many very successful legal suits against fluoridation. Many cities have halted fluoridation because it is indeed illegal to add dental treatment chemicals (allowed in toothpaste but designed not to be swallowed) into public drinking water.

In Escondido it was ruled that fluoridation alters the bodily chemistry of consumers. In Pennsylvania and in Texas it was ruled that fluoridated water consumption increases morbidity in those with cancer. In other cities various legal rulings against fluoridation have occurred even though in some those rulings were overturned by other courts on appeal. 

Richard Sauerheber, Ph.D.
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Regular Contributor

Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

Message 688 of 1,450
The addition of water additives is a standard, important and well accepted component of proper drinking water utilities. Fluoride is but one of the over 40 water additives available to utilities. By your standard all are "additional contaminants."
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Regular Contributor

Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

Message 689 of 1,450
No, America would not expected to be and is not cavity-free.

This is a classic example of the Straw Man logical fallacy.

Fluoridation is not a silver bullet cure but it does greatly decrease the cavity burden a population must bear. 2/3rd of the operations for mouth fulls of rotten teeth preschool children must have are avoided. The economic return on the fluoridation investment in lower dental bills varies between communities from 12% to over 13,000%.

References furnished if anyone desires.
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Regular Contributor

Re: Fluoride - Demand AARP Take Action

Message 690 of 1,450

I hope that the AARP staff and other uncommitted folks reading community water fluoridation opponents' highly referenced interpretation of various laws, federal responsibilities and water  and toxin oversight bureaucracies clearly understand that the Fluoride Action Network and its allies have zero successful legal challenges.  

This is despite six figure yearly fundraising, despite an in-house attorney (Michael Connett) and most importantly despite their impassioned conviction fluoridation is both illegal and immoral.

Zero . . .


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