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Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 10,386
Registered: ‎06-07-2010

Re: Why the Trump administration is failing

Message 41 of 74 (73 Views)

alferdpacker wrote:

NOTHAPPENING wrote:

sp362 wrote:

NOTHAPPENING wrote:

Panjandrum wrote:

Richva: Trump had a reputation for late and reduced payments to small business vendors.

 

 

It's also the reason he can't get any top DC lawyers to represent him.


You don't need top lawyers when no crime has been committed and the left is on a fishing expedition.


Why do you keep insisting that no crime has been committed before the investigation is complete?  Since lawyers demand their money up front, I don't believe that they don't want his business because they are afraid of payment, I do believe they don't want his business because he won't listen to them.


Is a person guilty of a crime because the left says so?  We have an open ended investigation to look for "crimes" against the country or Constitution.  No crime has been committed until evidence shows that a crime has been committed.  In this country, you are innocent until proved guilty.  I know this is something the left doesn't want to hear, but it is what it is.

 

If the left doesn't like those rules, move elsewhere!

 


Nope - going to completely ignore that utter nonsense that has never had the slightest bit of legal force behind it.

 

Tell us where "innocent until proved guilty" is stated to be law in the US.

 

It is nowhere stated as such in the Constitution - the 14th Amendment's "equal under the law" is not at all the same as a presumption of innocence - nor is it stated as such in any Federal or state statute.

 

There is the old Roman principle of law - Ei incumbit probatio qui dicit, non qui negat - Proof lies on him who asserts, not on him who denies.

There are similar principles in Islamic Law.

 

The only place that legal principle is actually stated in those words is in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights passed in 1948 by a majority of UN nations.

 

It should be noted that all of the Soviet Bloc nations abstained from voting on that declaration - because the Soviet Bloc never believed in Human Rights - South Africa abstained to protect it's system of apartheid - Saudi Arabia abstained because they are an absolutist monarchy - and just coincidentally, are the country that recently played lil donnie like a cheap toy guitar.

 


FYI - We don't follow Roman Law or Islamic Law, but we do follow U.S. law!

 

 The 5th and 14th amendments to the U.S. Constitution guarantee “due process of law” to all persons, including foreign students and other aliens in the US. Due process of law requires that orderly legal procedures be followed to establish guilt before a person can be put in jail or otherwise punished. In the United States, a person is considered innocent until proven guilty. The 14th amendment to the US Constitution guarantees to every person, aliens included, “equal protection under the law.”

 

https://www.wabash.edu/international/uslaws

 

Again I repeat - the left is on a "fishing expedition" and I don't expect even the smallest guppy to be caught!

 

 

Treasured Social Butterfly
Posts: 23,269
Registered: ‎07-11-2013

Re: Why the Trump administration is failing

Message 42 of 74 (80 Views)

NOTHAPPENING wrote:

sp362 wrote:

NOTHAPPENING wrote:

Panjandrum wrote:

Richva: Trump had a reputation for late and reduced payments to small business vendors.

 

 

It's also the reason he can't get any top DC lawyers to represent him.


You don't need top lawyers when no crime has been committed and the left is on a fishing expedition.


Why do you keep insisting that no crime has been committed before the investigation is complete?  Since lawyers demand their money up front, I don't believe that they don't want his business because they are afraid of payment, I do believe they don't want his business because he won't listen to them.


Is a person guilty of a crime because the left says so?  We have an open ended investigation to look for "crimes" against the country or Constitution.  No crime has been committed until evidence shows that a crime has been committed.  In this country, you are innocent until proved guilty.  I know this is something the left doesn't want to hear, but it is what it is.

 

If the left doesn't like those rules, move elsewhere!

 


Nope - going to completely ignore that utter nonsense that has never had the slightest bit of legal force behind it.

 

Tell us where "innocent until proved guilty" is stated to be law in the US.

 

It is nowhere stated as such in the Constitution - the 14th Amendment's "equal under the law" is not at all the same as a presumption of innocence - nor is it stated as such in any Federal or state statute.

 

There is the old Roman principle of law - Ei incumbit probatio qui dicit, non qui negat - Proof lies on him who asserts, not on him who denies.

There are similar principles in Islamic Law.

 

The only place that legal principle is actually stated in those words is in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights passed in 1948 by a majority of UN nations.

 

It should be noted that all of the Soviet Bloc nations abstained from voting on that declaration - because the Soviet Bloc never believed in Human Rights - South Africa abstained to protect it's system of apartheid - Saudi Arabia abstained because they are an absolutist monarchy - and just coincidentally, are the country that recently played lil donnie like a cheap toy guitar.

 

KAKISTOCRACY
Treasured Social Butterfly
Posts: 11,298
Registered: ‎02-28-2008

Re: Why the Trump administration is failing

Message 43 of 74 (76 Views)


Is a person guilty of a crime because the left says so?  We have an open ended investigation to look for "crimes" against the country or Constitution.  No crime has been committed until evidence shows that a crime has been committed.  In this country, you are innocent until proved guilty.  I know this is something the left doesn't want to hear, but it is what it is.

 

If the left doesn't like those rules, move elsewhere!


I think you are mixing "being guilty" with "being investigated". I have to admit, the evidence we have seen so far would lean toward guilty but that is not how our government works. 

 

You are correct about the constant investigations.  Look at all the investigations of Clintons and Obama.  Democrats observe, learn, and come back to bite the Republicans who think they are the only ones who can use the tactics they do. 

Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 19,448
Registered: ‎11-09-2011

Re: Why the Trump administration is failing

Message 44 of 74 (86 Views)

NOTHAPPENING wrote:

sp362 wrote:

NOTHAPPENING wrote:

Panjandrum wrote:

Richva: Trump had a reputation for late and reduced payments to small business vendors.

 

 

It's also the reason he can't get any top DC lawyers to represent him.


You don't need top lawyers when no crime has been committed and the left is on a fishing expedition.


Why do you keep insisting that no crime has been committed before the investigation is complete?  Since lawyers demand their money up front, I don't believe that they don't want his business because they are afraid of payment, I do believe they don't want his business because he won't listen to them.


Is a person guilty of a crime because the left says so?  We have an open ended investigation to look for "crimes" against the country or Constitution.  No crime has been committed until evidence shows that a crime has been committed.  In this country, you are innocent until proved guilty.  I know this is something the left doesn't want to hear, but it is what it is.

 

If the left doesn't like those rules, move elsewhere!


If Donny were not up to his orange toupee in kimchi he would not have been looking for a good criminal lawyer.

Instead he's stuck with the criminal who's been his lawyer while he defrauded all his business partners and suppliers.

Pointing out his long history of fraud and deceit is not saying he's guilty of the current charges.

It merely demonstrates how little regard for law and decency Der Trumper has demonstrated his whole life long.

If one draws the totally reasonable conclusion he's simply gotten caught again, only this time his double-dealing is a matter of National Security because he's POTUS and the one's he's colluding with are a hostile foreign government, not some sleazy lawyers and unscrupulous businesstwits, that's just a result of having better information.

Recognized Social Butterfly
Posts: 975
Registered: ‎01-01-2016

Re: Why the Trump administration is failing

Message 45 of 74 (82 Views)

NOTHAPPENING wrote:

sp362 wrote:

NOTHAPPENING wrote:

Panjandrum wrote:

Richva: Trump had a reputation for late and reduced payments to small business vendors.

 

 

It's also the reason he can't get any top DC lawyers to represent him.


You don't need top lawyers when no crime has been committed and the left is on a fishing expedition.


Why do you keep insisting that no crime has been committed before the investigation is complete?  Since lawyers demand their money up front, I don't believe that they don't want his business because they are afraid of payment, I do believe they don't want his business because he won't listen to them.


Is a person guilty of a crime because the left says so?  We have an open ended investigation to look for "crimes" against the country or Constitution.  No crime has been committed until evidence shows that a crime has been committed.  In this country, you are innocent until proved guilty.  I know this is something the left doesn't want to hear, but it is what it is.

 

If the left doesn't like those rules, move elsewhere!


Where did I say that he was guilty BEFORE the investigation was over?  He HAS hired a lawyer to help defend him (which does not mean he is guilty, it simply means he has hired one).  Your "AMERICA LOVE IT OR LEAVE IT" stance is disturbing and INSULTING.  Who decides which of the laws we have to love before we leave?  You?  You seem to have a real problem with checks and balances and seperation of powers and a free press, all in the Constitution.  Does that mean you don't love America and need to leave?

Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 10,386
Registered: ‎06-07-2010

Re: Why the Trump administration is failing

Message 46 of 74 (87 Views)

sp362 wrote:

NOTHAPPENING wrote:

Panjandrum wrote:

Richva: Trump had a reputation for late and reduced payments to small business vendors.

 

 

It's also the reason he can't get any top DC lawyers to represent him.


You don't need top lawyers when no crime has been committed and the left is on a fishing expedition.


Why do you keep insisting that no crime has been committed before the investigation is complete?  Since lawyers demand their money up front, I don't believe that they don't want his business because they are afraid of payment, I do believe they don't want his business because he won't listen to them.


Is a person guilty of a crime because the left says so?  We have an open ended investigation to look for "crimes" against the country or Constitution.  No crime has been committed until evidence shows that a crime has been committed.  In this country, you are innocent until proved guilty.  I know this is something the left doesn't want to hear, but it is what it is.

 

If the left doesn't like those rules, move elsewhere!

Recognized Social Butterfly
Posts: 975
Registered: ‎01-01-2016

Re: Why the Trump administration is failing

Message 47 of 74 (85 Views)

NOTHAPPENING wrote:

Panjandrum wrote:

Richva: Trump had a reputation for late and reduced payments to small business vendors.

 

 

It's also the reason he can't get any top DC lawyers to represent him.


You don't need top lawyers when no crime has been committed and the left is on a fishing expedition.


Why do you keep insisting that no crime has been committed before the investigation is complete?  Since lawyers demand their money up front, I don't believe that they don't want his business because they are afraid of payment, I do believe they don't want his business because he won't listen to them.

Highlighted
Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 10,386
Registered: ‎06-07-2010

Re: Why the Trump administration is failing

Message 48 of 74 (89 Views)

Panjandrum wrote:

Richva: Trump had a reputation for late and reduced payments to small business vendors.

 

 

It's also the reason he can't get any top DC lawyers to represent him.


You don't need top lawyers when no crime has been committed and the left is on a fishing expedition.

Treasured Social Butterfly
Posts: 11,298
Registered: ‎02-28-2008

Re: Why the Trump administration is failing

Message 49 of 74 (87 Views)

KidBoy2 wrote:


Your words...your opinion. Time will tell what his legacy will be.

You posted and started this thread by saying he went bankrupt 20 times..not true and that is why I posted ..I wish I had not posted on this thread.

I checked my source and you are correct. The number I used was wrong He went bankrupt 4 times. 

Super Social Butterfly
Posts: 557
Registered: ‎12-05-2009

Re: Why the Trump administration is failing

Message 50 of 74 (84 Views)

Richva: Trump had a reputation for late and reduced payments to small business vendors.

 

 

It's also the reason he can't get any top DC lawyers to represent him.