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Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 985
Registered: ‎01-02-2012

Re: Sanders ' Medicare for All Plan: Much Ado about Nothing

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Message 1 of 21 (211 Views)

NerdyMom wrote:

I am disappointed that he doesn't have a funding mechanism attached to the proposal.   In any event, I still want to see the CBO cost it out. 



https://www.sanders.senate.gov/download/medicare-for-all-act?id=6CA2351C-6EAE-4A11-BBE4-CE07984813C8...

 

Hey I finally found the bill (despite what I posted here about an hour ago) But it's going to be hard for CBO to cost out Sanders' Medicare for All plan when it does not indicate how it is to be paid for except with blanks

Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 1,660
Registered: ‎02-12-2011

Re: Sanders ' Medicare for All Plan: Much Ado about Nothing

Message 2 of 21 (209 Views)

Bernie's Bill is not really Medicare For All...at all.  Well yeah...but that is the phrase that has stuck with those advocating for a better health care system.  I think, to them it means that there can be a system run by the Federal Government that works pretty effectively.  Would it work applied to the entire population?????  Let's be realistic. You'd have to do something drastic about the "For Profit Health Care System".   

 

The "For Profit Health Care System" so beloved by the far right is really a tool for extortion.  That system is 'profitable' within the first tier and every tier that underpins the one above. A pyramid, so it is.  So....the sick pay, not just once, but every time they are forced to 'kick-in' or 'kick-off' for seemingly unrelated services.   Don't pay and you die....most likely in pain

 

Why is that, you say?  Well...preventative health care costs.  It too is "For Profit".  Even people who sorely need it will have to choose between paying an exorbitant premium for insurance, paying for it themselves or paying for putting food on the table.  Or maybe paying tuition at the "For Profit" university which is the only one with room left to accept 'the kid'.  Priorities...based on immediate realities, donchasee?

 

Now.....I don't think anyone needs 'bean-counter specifics' to see how the system is working right now, how the 'conservatives' would like it to continue to work and how it could work if we all stepped away a bit and got rational again.  There IS only one system that will serve the people and not the profiteers.  You know what it is....say it after me..."Single Payer Non-Profit Health Care For All From Conception to Cremation".  See how easy it is?  So....there's the concept.  NOW...figure out how to get it done....that's ALL you have to worry about.

 

Bernie is a pragmatist.  Has to be.  He knows full well what he proposes now will be a far cry from what is enacted into law....IF it ever gets that far.

 

IF you cornered Bernie in the back room of the local bar and wouldn't let him out 'til he told you what he was really all about, I'd give odds he'd say "Single Payer Non-Profit Health Care" for everyone for life.  I'd give odds he'd also say the issue has to be kept in front of the voter until it get's done.  First round comes up in 2018. 

 

That's when things could start to change IF the political hacks feathering their nests get kicked out of Congress and more rational people honestly concerned with peoples' welfare are put in.  A real proposal could easily be drafted that wouldn't need to be called Medicare For All.  That's not really what this is all about. 

 

So, anyway...that's a long-winded way of saying Bernie probably does know what he's doing....really. And he's not telling any lies along the way.  It can be done.  It won't get done overnight....not unless the non-rational magically 'see the light' and 'kick over the traces'.  How you like them mixed metaphors?

Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 22,423
Registered: ‎03-04-2009

Re: Sanders ' Medicare for All Plan: Much Ado about Nothing

Message 3 of 21 (234 Views)

NerdyMom wrote:

It will hurt me tax wise, but that's fine. I want to see how CBO costs it out.

 

But a typical middle class family that earns $50,000 would only spend $466 out of pocket on the premium.  That's amazing.

 

 


Right now I will be paying about 600.00 for me and my husband with a prescription coverage with a Medicare supplemental.
Until now, we didn't think of it necessary, but the Advantage programs have gotten really bad. and now we need to have the coverage  that we feel that we need. 

Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 22,423
Registered: ‎03-04-2009

Re: Sanders ' Medicare for All Plan: Much Ado about Nothing

Message 4 of 21 (234 Views)

ChasKy53 wrote:

Bernie's plan is not actuall Medicare as we now know it, so the 50% out of pocket costs under his proposed plan is bunk. Medicare for all is a call name for his plan, with much better coverage.

 

When a universal health care plan for America was first introduced, what developed from it? Medicare for the aged did, it was a compromise, it's past time to move on, improve Medicare and include all from cradle to grave. It can be done in this great country of ours if we ignore the $$Multi-Billion$$ dollar special interests who stand in the way.


You said it,  we cannot have a National Health Care system by any name until we deal with the cost of the Pharmaceuticals and other special interests. 
There is no apetite for either Republicans or Democrats to actually give up the nice things that they get from all the special incterests. We should at least be able to recognize that.

Super Social Butterfly
Posts: 1,010
Registered: ‎12-31-2016

Re: Sanders ' Medicare for All Plan: Much Ado about Nothing

Message 5 of 21 (254 Views)

byrondennis wrote:

NerdyMom wrote:


I got it from his website. Employers pay 6.2% of income and employees pay 2.2% of income.   A family making $50,000 who gets standard deductions on their taxes would pay $466 total.  It's  income based, not age based. No out out of pocket costs. As ChasKy said, it's not identical to Medicare today.

 


I think you are looking at last year's Sanders plan (which in turn was different than the Sanders plan a few years before that). The far left wing (they should know) Vox web site is now reporting

 

  • "The Sanders plan goes into great detail about the type of coverage Americans would receive. But it provides no information on how it would finance such a generous health care system. Americans’ taxes would have to change to pay for this kind of proposal. But it’s impossible to tell who would pay significantly more for their coverage and who would pay less, and by how much. This is a crucial part of any health care plan, and in the Sanders proposal, it is notably absent."

Vox is also reporting that the Sanders proposal would work differently for people already on Medicare than Sanders himself wrote in this morning's New York Times. Vox claims

 

  • "(Today's) Medicare, employer coverage, and these other countries (single payer systems) show that nearly every insurance scheme we’re familiar with covers a smaller set of benefits with more out-of-pocket spending on the part of citizens. Private insurance plans often spring up to fill these gaps (in Canada, for example, vision and dental insurance is often sponsored by employers, much like in the United States). The reason they went this way is clear: It’s cheaper to run a health plan with fewer benefits. The plan Sanders proposes has no analogue among the single-payer systems that currently exist. By covering a more comprehensive set of benefits and asking no cost sharing of enrollees, it is likely to cost the government significantly more than programs other countries have adopted."

Yes, I was looking at what's on his website.   That involves employer and employee taxes instead of paying premiums.    

 

I am disappointed that he doesn't have a funding mechanism attached to the proposal.   In any event, I still want to see the CBO cost it out. 

 

Knowing Bernie, it will be income-based.  The wealthier among us will pay more.   And personally, I think that's how it should be.  

Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 21,691
Registered: ‎11-07-2009

Re: Sanders ' Medicare for All Plan: Much Ado about Nothing

Message 6 of 21 (264 Views)

gordyfl wrote:

No matter how you look at it, Bernie's Plan sounds a lot better than that "Skinny Plan".


Health care costs and miserable health care statistics in this country are leading us down a path to a single payer plan like HR676 'Medicare for All'. It will happen .................. just not all at once.


"The only thing man learns from history is man learns nothing from history"
Treasured Social Butterfly
Posts: 3,235
Registered: ‎09-05-2008

Re: Sanders ' Medicare for All Plan: Much Ado about Nothing

Message 7 of 21 (274 Views)

No matter how you look at it, Bernie's Plan sounds a lot better than that "Skinny Plan".

Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 985
Registered: ‎01-02-2012

Re: Sanders ' Medicare for All Plan: Much Ado about Nothing

Message 8 of 21 (314 Views)

NerdyMom wrote:

What is Bernie lying about? 


I think the proposal will be quite different than the simple addition of dental and vision to Medicare that Sanders claimed in the New York Times on the morning of September 13. Reporting at noon, the far left wing Vox web site seemed to agree.

 

Perhaps, rather than say lie, I should have said the message changes depending on the listener

Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 985
Registered: ‎01-02-2012

Re: Sanders ' Medicare for All Plan: Much Ado about Nothing

Message 9 of 21 (314 Views)

NerdyMom wrote:


I got it from his website. Employers pay 6.2% of income and employees pay 2.2% of income.   A family making $50,000 who gets standard deductions on their taxes would pay $466 total.  It's  income based, not age based. No out out of pocket costs. As ChasKy said, it's not identical to Medicare today.

 


I think you are looking at last year's Sanders plan (which in turn was different than the Sanders plan a few years before that). The far left wing (they should know) Vox web site is now reporting

 

  • "The Sanders plan goes into great detail about the type of coverage Americans would receive. But it provides no information on how it would finance such a generous health care system. Americans’ taxes would have to change to pay for this kind of proposal. But it’s impossible to tell who would pay significantly more for their coverage and who would pay less, and by how much. This is a crucial part of any health care plan, and in the Sanders proposal, it is notably absent."

Vox is also reporting that the Sanders proposal would work differently for people already on Medicare than Sanders himself wrote in this morning's New York Times. Vox claims

 

  • "(Today's) Medicare, employer coverage, and these other countries (single payer systems) show that nearly every insurance scheme we’re familiar with covers a smaller set of benefits with more out-of-pocket spending on the part of citizens. Private insurance plans often spring up to fill these gaps (in Canada, for example, vision and dental insurance is often sponsored by employers, much like in the United States). The reason they went this way is clear: It’s cheaper to run a health plan with fewer benefits. The plan Sanders proposes has no analogue among the single-payer systems that currently exist. By covering a more comprehensive set of benefits and asking no cost sharing of enrollees, it is likely to cost the government significantly more than programs other countries have adopted."
Super Social Butterfly
Posts: 1,010
Registered: ‎12-31-2016

Re: Sanders ' Medicare for All Plan: Much Ado about Nothing

Message 10 of 21 (323 Views)

Al Franken has signed on......and he's one smart guy.