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Respected Social Butterfly
Posts: 41,497
Registered: ‎06-03-2013

Re: My brother didn't die fighting Hitler for Nazis to go unchallenged today

Message 1 of 36 (22 Views)

MIseker wrote:

I cede to you the point of this decision. It says the govt cannot restrict hate speech. The govt. We as citizens still have a moral obligation to oppose it, and today Trump finally said a few things I can agree with. 


I'll cede to the Supreme Court decision.

Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 28,226
Registered: ‎02-21-2014

Re: My brother didn't die fighting Hitler for Nazis to go unchallenged today

Message 2 of 36 (26 Views)

MIseker wrote:


lol. is hate speech constitutional? its my understanding it is not. im talking about WHAT IS SAID..not the rigt of free speech. you do realize, only the goverment is prevented from stopping free speech. Counterrotestors have the right to disagree with what is being said.

 

The determination of "hate speech" is in the purview of the legal and law enforcement - not the left wing brownshirts.

 


 

Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 28,226
Registered: ‎02-21-2014

Re: My brother didn't die fighting Hitler for Nazis to go unchallenged today

Message 3 of 36 (32 Views)

gruffstuff wrote:

If a "be a proud American" message is considered Nazi - the blind hatred crowd is a real threat to our way of life.

 

That is a cop out, this has been going on since well before the election. You and the others knew about all this before you voted for Trump and you all voted for him anyway.

 

So take a fifty pound block of salt, carve it into a bust of Trump, coat it with camphor oil, and go Seig Heil yourself with it.


That is a pretty strong, possibly offensive, statement. What is "Nazi" about our President??

 

I know that "sexist, racist, xenophobe, homophobe" and the rest has been the bumper sticker of the left, but let's focus on the "Nazi" stuff.

Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 28,226
Registered: ‎02-21-2014

Re: My brother didn't die fighting Hitler for Nazis to go unchallenged today

Message 4 of 36 (34 Views)

MIseker wrote:


As a proud IWW member I can tell you a lot of KKK rallys are opposed ( and sometimes violently ) by members of the Union. More so in the past, before fascist elements in the govt almost wiped the IWW out, but it lives. The man shot in Seattle was an IWW member and the GDC there is at every hate rally.. and the reason so many hate rallys are held there is because the haters know there will be violence and press. If you review some videos of recent events you will see that IWW flag at all of them.


When was it that the fascists in our government almost wiped out the Wobblies? Was it when Samuel Gompers of the AFL decided that his workers were Americans and would not follow the Communist world-wide concept of Eugene Debs and the Wobblies? 

 

As to your Seattle shooting - it seems like your group is back in the 1930 with the Communists fighting the Nazis in Europe. This is America, leave your old, old, old petty squabbles out of contemporary politics and American life.

 

Back to the topic - do you think the guy died in WWII so that the your Communist has beens can decide they are the law when there is a demonstration going on?

 

And, back to the topic - what would the Wobblies have us do about Americans who are whacked out enough to do that Seig Heil silliness? Shall we all get big wrenches and chase them down the street?

Valued Social Butterfly
Posts: 28,226
Registered: ‎02-21-2014

Re: My brother didn't die fighting Hitler for Nazis to go unchallenged today

Message 5 of 36 (38 Views)

MIseker wrote:

rk9152 wrote:

MIseker wrote:
The ACLU stands up for everyones free speech, even the Nazis, and thats fine its their job. How we react as a society, is up to us.

You do not like the Nazis, I do not like the Nazis. Your solution is to go kill them with big wrenches. Is that the American way that the fella in the topic died for??


How silly. He died with that wrench in his hand.


Silly???? This is the first I heard that Sen Hatch's brother (the topic) died with a wrench in his hand.

 

Once you sort that fiasco out, let's get back to the basics - what shall we do with Nazis in your mind?

Treasured Social Butterfly
Posts: 6,388
Registered: ‎11-18-2009

Re: My brother didn't die fighting Hitler for Nazis to go unchallenged today

Message 6 of 36 (67 Views)

TxGrandpa2 wrote:

MIseker wrote:

lol. is hate speech constitutional? its my understanding it is not.

 


What is hate speech?  Does the Constitution give the definition?  What did the Supreme Court say about 'hate speech'?

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2017/06/19/supreme-court-unanimously-reaffi...

 

Supreme Court unanimously reaffirms: There is no ‘hate speech’ exception to the First Amendment

 

"And the justices made clear that speech that some view as racially offensive is protected not just against outright prohibition but also against lesser restrictions. In Matal, the government refused to register “The Slants” as a band’s trademark, on the ground that the name might be seen as demeaning to Asian Americans. The government wasn’t trying to forbid the band from using the mark; it was just denying it certain protections that trademarks get against unauthorized use by third parties. But even in this sort of program, the court held, viewpoint discrimination — including against allegedly racially offensive viewpoints — is unconstitutional. And this no-viewpoint-discrimination principle has long been seen as applying to exclusion of speakers from universities, denial of tax exemptions to nonprofits, and much more."

 

 


I cede to you the point of this decision. It says the govt cannot restrict hate speech. The govt. We as citizens still have a moral obligation to oppose it, and today Trump finally said a few things I can agree with. 

So it begins.
Respected Social Butterfly
Posts: 41,497
Registered: ‎06-03-2013

Re: My brother didn't die fighting Hitler for Nazis to go unchallenged today

Message 7 of 36 (79 Views)

MIseker wrote:

lol. is hate speech constitutional? its my understanding it is not.

 


What is hate speech?  Does the Constitution give the definition?  What did the Supreme Court say about 'hate speech'?

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2017/06/19/supreme-court-unanimously-reaffi...

 

Supreme Court unanimously reaffirms: There is no ‘hate speech’ exception to the First Amendment

 

"And the justices made clear that speech that some view as racially offensive is protected not just against outright prohibition but also against lesser restrictions. In Matal, the government refused to register “The Slants” as a band’s trademark, on the ground that the name might be seen as demeaning to Asian Americans. The government wasn’t trying to forbid the band from using the mark; it was just denying it certain protections that trademarks get against unauthorized use by third parties. But even in this sort of program, the court held, viewpoint discrimination — including against allegedly racially offensive viewpoints — is unconstitutional. And this no-viewpoint-discrimination principle has long been seen as applying to exclusion of speakers from universities, denial of tax exemptions to nonprofits, and much more."

 

 

Treasured Social Butterfly
Posts: 6,388
Registered: ‎11-18-2009

Re: My brother didn't die fighting Hitler for Nazis to go unchallenged today

Message 8 of 36 (89 Views)

TxGrandpa2 wrote:

MIseker wrote:


I have noticed a difference between the vets that fought commie and the vets that fought nazis. Just an opinion, subject to being wrong.

 


And didn't the counter-protesters act to deny the ones who had a permit to hold a rally, the right to free speech?  You support someone who would deny others their constitutional rights?  What about the other events around the country that they have interferred with violence? 

 

Of course in the thinking of some they are innocent of wrong doing. 


lol. is hate speech constitutional? its my understanding it is not. im talking about WHAT IS SAID..not the rigt of free speech. you do realize, only the goverment is prevented from stopping free speech. Counterrotestors have the right to disagree with what is being said.

 

So it begins.
Respected Social Butterfly
Posts: 41,497
Registered: ‎06-03-2013

Re: My brother didn't die fighting Hitler for Nazis to go unchallenged today

Message 9 of 36 (95 Views)

gruffstuff wrote:

If a "be a proud American" message is considered Nazi - the blind hatred crowd is a real threat to our way of life.

 

That is a cop out, this has been going on since well before the election. You and the others knew about all this before you voted for Trump and you all voted for him anyway.

 

So take a fifty pound block of salt, carve it into a bust of Trump, coat it with camphor oil, and go Seig Heil yourself with it.


So anyone who didn't vote for Hillary is a NAZI?   There is but one correct political party and that is the Democratic one?  How American is what you posted? 

Respected Social Butterfly
Posts: 41,497
Registered: ‎06-03-2013

Re: My brother didn't die fighting Hitler for Nazis to go unchallenged today

Message 10 of 36 (99 Views)

MIseker wrote:


I have noticed a difference between the vets that fought commie and the vets that fought nazis. Just an opinion, subject to being wrong.

 


And didn't the counter-protesters act to deny the ones who had a permit to hold a rally, the right to free speech?  You support someone who would deny others their constitutional rights?  What about the other events around the country that they have interferred with violence? 

 

Of course in the thinking of some they are innocent of wrong doing.