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Treasured Social Butterfly
Posts: 19,384
Registered: ‎12-25-2011

Re: Talking with others about grief

Message 51 of 70 (2,777 Views)

I remember that one very well .. but saw too many people who were still falling in the same hole, as they were falling into 3 or 4 years earlier.


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Regular Social Butterfly
Posts: 409
Registered: ‎04-28-2014

Re: Talking with others about grief

Message 52 of 70 (2,778 Views)

ASTRAEA wrote:

@GailL1 - Most people use "move on" and "move foreward" interchangably .. unless they think someone might accidentally think "move on" means "move backwards". What I saw was people repeating the same loop over & over again, drawing the same lines in the sand, allowing them to be violated the same way, and returning to square one every few years.


Kinda like this?

 

“I walk down the street.
There is a deep hole in the sidewalk.
I fall in.
I am lost... I am helpless.
It isn't my fault.
It takes forever to find a way out.

I walk down the same street.
There is a deep hole in the sidewalk.
I pretend I don't see it.
I fall in again.
I can't believe I am in the same place.
But, it isn't my fault.
It still takes me a long time to get out.

I walk down the same street.
There is a deep hole in the sidewalk.
I see it is there.
I still fall in. It's a habit.
My eyes are open.
I know where I am.
It is my fault. I get out immediately.

walk down the same street.
There is a deep hole in the sidewalk.
I walk around it.

I walk down another street.”


Portia Nelson, There's a Hole in My Sidewalk: The Romance of Self-Discovery

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Posts: 409
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Re: Talking with others about grief

Message 53 of 70 (2,779 Views)

I love this poem.

 

The Thing Is
to love life, to love it even
when you have no stomach for it
and everything you've held dear
crumbles like burnt paper in your hands,
your throat filled with the silt of it.
When grief sits with you, its tropical heat
thickening the air, heavy as water
more fit for gills than lungs;
when grief weights you like your own flesh
only more of it, an obesity of grief,
you think, How can a body withstand this?
Then you hold life like a face
between your palms, a plain face
no charming smile, no violet eyes,
and you say, yes, I will take you
I will love you, again.
Ellen Bass

Treasured Social Butterfly
Posts: 19,384
Registered: ‎12-25-2011

Re: Talking with others about grief

Message 54 of 70 (2,780 Views)

@GailL1 - Most people use "move on" and "move foreward" interchangably .. unless they think someone might accidentally think "move on" means "move backwards". What I saw was people repeating the same loop over & over again, drawing the same lines in the sand, allowing them to be violated the same way, and returning to square one every few years.


Registered on Online Community since 2007!
Regular Social Butterfly
Posts: 409
Registered: ‎04-28-2014

Re: Talking with others about grief

Message 55 of 70 (2,776 Views)

GailL1 wrote:

However there is other grief associated with the loss of a loved and cared for person when their body remains.


You are SO RIGHT. This is the challenge of dementia caregiving. Or one of them. One of many.

 

This is a grief that is real and piercing.

 

How do you cope with it, GailL?

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Re: Talking with others about grief

Message 56 of 70 (2,776 Views)

ASTRAEA wrote:

@JaneCares - There are many addictive behaviors that are similar to alcoholism, and for families to deal with. Since Alanon's been around so long, it was recommended that I attend their meetings, because many regulars have so many years recovery .. although alcohol wasn't the specific "drug of choice".

 

After a couple of years, I did feel that many regulars were on an endless "loop", and that they enjoyed the 12-step camaraderie so much, they really didn't want to "move on" to the next chapter of their lives. It began to feel like being at a movie, where you came in mid-way, and have gotten back to that point again .. time to move on to something else.


I agree. I'm a former attendee. Someone dear to me has been going to Alanon for 30 years, and somehow she finds fresh inspiration. It works for some. It was very helpful to me, years ago. And it wasn't alcoholism that was the issue.

 

Jane

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Posts: 8,456
Registered: ‎08-18-2008

Re: Talking with others about grief

Message 57 of 70 (2,782 Views)

ASTRAEA wrote:

@JaneCares - There are many addictive behaviors that are similar to alcoholism, and for families to deal with. Since Alanon's been around so long, it was recommended that I attend their meetings, because many regulars have so many years recovery .. although alcohol wasn't the specific "drug of choice".

 

After a couple of years, I did feel that many regulars were on an endless "loop", and that they enjoyed the 12-step camaraderie so much, they really didn't want to "move on" to the next chapter of their lives. It began to feel like being at a movie, where you came in mid-way, and have gotten back to that point again .. time to move on to something else.


I think you have the wrong idea about Al-Anon and related groups like Alateen - or even AA.

12-Step Programs are not designed so much to "move on" as they are to "move forward", meaning to learn a new way of life and dealing with life on its terms.

 

Since life is constantly evolving for each of us, it is a never-ending learning of dealing with it as a whole but outside specific help may also be warranted as circumstances happen, like dealing with grief when it involves the death of a loved and cared for person. 

 

However there is other grief associated with the loss of a loved and cared for person when their body remains.

Treasured Social Butterfly
Posts: 19,384
Registered: ‎12-25-2011

Re: Talking with others about grief

Message 58 of 70 (2,760 Views)

@JaneCares - There are many addictive behaviors that are similar to alcoholism, and for families to deal with. Since Alanon's been around so long, it was recommended that I attend their meetings, because many regulars have so many years recovery .. although alcohol wasn't the specific "drug of choice".

 

After a couple of years, I did feel that many regulars were on an endless "loop", and that they enjoyed the 12-step camaraderie so much, they really didn't want to "move on" to the next chapter of their lives. It began to feel like being at a movie, where you came in mid-way, and have gotten back to that point again .. time to move on to something else.


Registered on Online Community since 2007!
Regular Social Butterfly
Posts: 409
Registered: ‎04-28-2014

Re: Talking with others about grief

Message 59 of 70 (2,778 Views)

12 Step programs are remarkable sources of help and healing for so many. For millions. I'm a veteran of Alanon myself.


Jane

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Posts: 409
Registered: ‎04-28-2014

Re: Talking with others about grief

Message 60 of 70 (2,771 Views)
I'm sorry you've had this experience, too, PattyDiane! What a drag!

I used to be the facilitator for a bunch of support groups at an area university hospital. They were all about cancer. Newly diagnosed, to "Advanced or recurrent" cancer groups. The groups over time would monitor themselves; that is, eventually several natural leaders would model 'good group behavior' by saying things like, well, that is certainly a challenging story. does anyone else have one like it? this 'universalization' is one of the important therapeutic aspects of a group. What seems like my private fear or misery is representative of a challenge many or most others face.
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